AG2003/3056, Transcript of Proceedings [2003] AIRCTrans 2084 (2 June 2003)

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TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS


O/N 2680

AUSTRALIAN INDUSTRIAL

RELATIONS COMMISSION

DEPUTY PRESIDENT HAMILTON

AG2003/3056

APPLICATION FOR CERTIFICATION
OF AGREEMENT

Application under section 170LJ of the Act
by Transfield Services (Australia) Pty Limited
and Another for certification of the Transfield
Services - ETU Enterprise Agreement 2003-2005

MELBOURNE

11.02 AM, THURSDAY, 15 MAY 2003

PN1

MR B. FLEINER: I appear for Transfield Services (Australia) Pty Limited.

PN2

MR G. GLOVER: I represent the ETU in this matter.

PN3

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Thank you very much. I am sorry to keep you all waiting. Who would like to start?

PN4

MR FLEINER: Commissioner, it is our application. I would just like to mention that in the 11th hour of his process there has been a dispute arise between the parties in respect - not in respect to the content of the document nor any matters that were considered and accepted by the employees, but in the application of a provision of the agreement. Until that matter is sorted out, the CEPU has stated they are reluctant to agree to the document being certified and if I could I would ask for an adjournment of a few days to have this matter sorted out and bring the application back to the Commission and have the document certified.

PN5

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Right. So you are both of this view, are you?

PN6

MR GLOVER: Yes, your Honour.

PN7

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: All right. On that basis, I will adjourn the matter. What would you like me to do; just adjourn it and then you can advise my office?

PN8

MR FLEINER: No, no, we would like a date set if that is possible. We are pretty anxious to get this document certified.

PN9

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: All right. Well, just bear with me for a minute.

PN10

MR FLEINER: Certainly.

PN11

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Today is what?

PN12

MR FLEINER: Today is Thursday the 15th.

PN13

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Look, what I might do is this. It seems to me to be wasteful to have two hearings, so I will allow you to deal with the issues - why don't you deal with the statutory tests now and then we can certify the agreement on the basis of those once you have lodged an advice to my office that you now wish the matter to be proceeded with. Why don't we do that? Would that be acceptable or not?

PN14

MR FLEINER: So you are saying - just to get the matter clear, you are saying, your Honour, that the certification would be subject to the lodgment that the matter has been cleared up.

PN15

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes. And, of course, if you don't wish the agreement certified for whatever reason, then we will have a hearing in relation to the issue and unless you both agree with that, will argue it out. Will that be a suitable course of action or not?

PN16

MR FLEINER: That would be suitable to the company, your Honour, because - and I am sure I am pretty right, but we are both intent on having the matter certified. It is just this one issue - the practicalities of this one issue that we need to get agreement on.

PN17

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: It just seems more efficient of the Commission's time as well as yours. All right, well - - -

PN18

MR GLOVER: Your Honour - - -

PN19

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes, Mr Glover.

PN20

MR GLOVER: It was put on to me today this change or what Barry brought to me today. Now, the thing is, if it had have been brought to our attention four weeks ago, it would have been dealt with successfully four weeks ago, because we had protected action going at the time and we certainly would have - no doubt it would have been in our favour. Now, this has come up at the 11th hour. I would like it adjourned because I would like to seek some advice on it as well. I would rather not go through with it and set a date.

PN21

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: So you want a hearing; you don't want to deal with the statutory tests now?

PN22

MR GLOVER: No.

PN23

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: That is all right, I won't do it then. If the parties would prefer to spend their time in the Commission, I have no difficulty with that.

PN24

MR FLEINER: Sorry, your Honour. Look, if it is of any assistance at all, just immediately prior to this hearing I sought instructions and was unable to obtain them. That could be a different position now. If the parties have got time, perhaps an adjournment of half-an-hour might even assist this matter, if the Commission is available.

PN25

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes. Well, Mr Glover?

PN26

MR GLOVER: Yes, maybe half-past 11, 20 minutes.

PN27

MR FLEINER: Yes.

PN28

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: All right. Well, I will adjourn the matter then until 11.30 and we see where we get to then.

PN29

MR GLOVER: Yes.

PN30

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Thank you very much.

SHORT ADJOURNMENT [11.08am]

RESUMED [11.32am]

PN31

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Right. Is everybody happy?

PN32

MR FLEINER: Your Honour, we have been unable to advance the matter between the parties, so I really have no alternative. And the reason for that is I haven't been able to contact people that I need to inform. There is a cost impact to this and we need instructions to operate in the interests of the company and its employees, so I have no alternative at this stage to continue seeking the adjournment. In discussion with Mr Glover, we would be quite happy for a Wednesday time slot if that is at all possible.

PN33

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Next Wednesday? I have a Full Bench matter.

PN34

MR FLEINER: Or Tuesday.

PN35

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Look, would the Friday be suitable? Would that be acceptable?

PN36

MR GLOVER: Yes, your Honour, from our side.

PN37

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: All right, well - - -

PN38

MR FLEINER: Are you saying, what, Friday of this week - next week?

PN39

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Next week. That is the 23rd. 10.15, the 23rd. Is there anything else we can do today?

PN40

MR FLEINER: Unfortunately no.

PN41

MR GLOVER: No.

PN42

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: So both sides are agreed to an adjournment?

PN43

MR FLEINER: Yes.

PN44

THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT: All right, thank you. This matter is adjourned until Friday, the 23rd at 10.15.

ADJOURNED UNTIL FRIDAY, 23 MAY 2003 [11.34am]