C2003/2391, Transcript of Proceedings [2003] AIRCTrans 2459 (17 June 2003)

AUSCRIPT PTY LTD
ABN 76 082 664 220

Level 4, 179 Queen St MELBOURNE Vic 3000
(GPO Box 1114 MELBOURNE Vic 3001)
DX 305 Melbourne Tel:[phone] Fax:[phone]

TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS


O/N 3122

AUSTRALIAN INDUSTRIAL

RELATIONS COMMISSION

SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT LACY

C2003/2391

AUSTRALASIAN CORRECTIONAL
MANAGEMENT PTY LTD

and

THE COMMUNITY AND PUBLIC
SECTOR UNION

Notification pursuant to section 99 of the Act
of an industrial dispute re terms and conditions
of employment at Fulham Correctional Centre

MELBOURNE

9.04 AM, TUESDAY, 3 JUNE 2003

PN1

MR M. SERONG: I seek leave to appear for Australasian Correctional Management Pty Ltd.

PN2

MR M. PERICA: I appear on behalf of the Community and Public Sector Union and I take no issue with the leave, your Honour.

PN3

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Leave is granted Mr Serong.

PN4

MR SERONG: Thank you, your Honour.

PN5

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes, Mr Serong, this was your matter and I have listed it for mention this morning to see whether or not there was any issue about the finding of dispute and whether or not there had been any discussions between the parties about that.

PN6

MR SERONG: Well, we haven't had a detailed discussion, your Honour. I haven't had any indication that the union will object to the finding of dispute. The union has, however, in a letter that I think you have seen, your Honour, because it was attached to the notification, indicated that it will be serving its own log of claims. If that were to happen in the near future the point may become academic, your Honour. We certainly do seek a dispute finding this morning but given what is foreshadowed in the union letter I am not sure that it would be problematic.

PN7

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: All right, what do you say, Mr Perica.

PN8

MR PERICA: We didn't get served with this until late Friday night and I understand it is a bit of a - it is not common for employers or their legal people to serve logs, so I can understand the problem. I don't think we would take any technical issue with the log, in fact I don't think we would oppose the finding of a dispute, but I would prefigure, and it would be fairly obvious to everyone here, that the log which was being served by the employer is insufficient for our purposes and we intend to serve a log with sufficient ambit in the fullness of time, and we move towards the making of an award that will enable us to mount certain arguments which, I am sure your Honour will be perfectly aware of.

PN9

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Which could create the ambit, no doubt.

PN10

MR PERICA: Yes.

PN11

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: We have the two logs before us.

PN12

MR PERICA: Yes.

PN13

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes, all right, thank you Mr Perica. Would, Mr Serong, Mr Perica takes no objection or doesn't object to the finding of a dispute. What difficulties might arise from a finding of a dispute in this matter and then a subsequent dispute notification by the union?

PN14

MR SERONG: Your Honour, the instructions I have are to proceed this morning and seek a dispute finding.

PN15

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes.

PN16

MR SERONG: If the union chooses to serve a log, no doubt, it would be the most practical approach to join the two, but at this stage, that not having happened, ACM does press for a dispute finding this morning if that were the way your Honour were to decide.

PN17

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes.

PN18

MR PERICA: Well, perhaps, your Honour, I could - perhaps if you could give us two weeks to serve a log, that way the issues of two C numbers might be avoided and then, you know, there will be a dispute as to ambit before you and etcetera, etcetera.

PN19

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: You don't think I should try and promote our statistics and get two C numbers? Look I mean - well do you have any objection to adjourning this matter pending a further notice of dispute by the - - -

PN20

MR SERONG: Well, yes, your Honour. My instructions are to seek a dispute finding this morning, that was the clear instruction from the client and so I put that position to you, your Honour.

PN21

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Look, I think I will make a finding, Mr Perica. It is not going to prejudice your position and I will just join the two files when your notice of dispute arrives. So, I will make a finding of dispute, the parties to the dispute being Australasian Correctional Management Pty Ltd and the CPSU, the Community and Public Sector Union. The matters in dispute are the matters set out in the log of claims attached to the notice of dispute filed by ACM and I direct the parties to confer on the matters in dispute and I will list the matter for report back in a month's time, subject of course, to any notice of dispute being filed by CPSU, in which event I will list this matter at the same time as that matter.

PN22

MR PERICA: Thank you, your Honour.

PN23

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Anything else?

PN24

MR SERONG: No, your Honour.

PN25

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: No, I adjourn that matter. Thank you

ADJOURNED INDEFINITELY [9.10am]