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Australian Industrial Relations Commission Transcripts |
AUSCRIPT PTY LTD
ABN 76 082 664 220
Level 4, 179 Queen St MELBOURNE Vic 3000
(GPO Box 1114 MELBOURNE Vic 3001)
Tel:(03) 9672-5608 Fax:(03) 9670-8883
TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS
AUSTRALIAN INDUSTRIAL
RELATIONS COMMISSION
COMMISSIONER HINGLEY
C2003/4410
AUTOMOTIVE, FOOD, METALS, ENGINEERING,
PRINTING AND KINDRED INDUSTRIES UNION
and
QEK GLOBAL SOLUTIONS (AU) PTY LTD
and OTHERS
Notification pursuant to section 99 of the Act
of a dispute re wages and conditions of
employment
MELBOURNE
10.02 AM, FRIDAY, 3 OCTOBER 2003
Continued from 11.8.03
PN447
THE COMMISSIONER: I think we were at the point that you were cross-examining, Mr Lawrence, and we had a witness.
PN448
MR A. LAWRENCE: I was in the process of cross-examining, Commissioner. It is this Mr Lawrence.
PN449
THE COMMISSIONER: You can understand my confusion, can't you.
PN450
MR B. LAWRENCE: It was Mr A not Mr B.
PN451
PN452
THE COMMISSIONER: We won't reswear you. You are still under oath?---Yes.
PN453
Yes, Mr Lawrence.
PN454
MR A. LAWRENCE: Mr Carbin, good morning?---Good morning.
PN455
The QEK sign site in Port Melbourne, there is a registered licensed motor car trader, that is Holden, that is registered in respect of that QEK site?---I am not clear on the question. So you are asking what is the address on the LMCT?
PN456
The LMCT covers the Port Melbourne site. The Holden Licensed Motor Car Trader registration covers the Port Melbourne site and is number 1770. Does that ring any bells with you?---I have actually never seen the LMCT, so from my perspective it could be a question directed to Holden but it is not a QEK LMCT.
PN457
No, right, but - and I will come to this shortly - cars are sold from the QEK site in Port Melbourne by Holden?---Yes.
PN458
And the Holden used car trader registration is what is relied upon to sell those cars from the QEK site at Port Melbourne?---Yes.
PN459
And does QEK have a registered Holden dealer code, Ms Carbin?---Yes.
PN460
That is number 188, are you aware of that?---Correct.
PN461
Now, the core services provided by QEK, Ms Carbin, relate to Holden company and lease vehicles, that is correct?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN462
And that includes company cars for Holden executives?---Correct.
PN463
And it includes lease cars for Holden executives?---Yes.
PN464
Or perhaps the partner of a Holden executive?---Yes.
PN465
And it also includes lease cars for other Holden employees, for example, employees with over five years' service?---Yes.
PN466
And employees who are above a certain Holden classification level who have access to - - -?---Clarify that?
PN467
Employees over a certain level within Holden have access to lease car arrangements?---Yes.
PN468
And that of course includes employees with over five years' service, includes employees on the shop floor, so to speak?---Yes.
PN469
Now, the process that QEK engages in, Ms Carbin, is that - and correct me if I am wrong here - QEK receives an order from a Holden employee for a particular car?---Yes.
PN470
The initiation of the process, for example, a Commodore. That request is processed by the vehicle administration section of QEK?---Yes.
PN471
Lease deduction forms for example are prepared?---Yes.
PN472
And the car arrives at the QEK site or at the QEK holding yard at Webb Dock eventually, does it not?---Yes.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN473
And the vehicle then is logged in by the importers - - -?---Yes.
PN474
- - - in the vehicle handling area?---That is correct.
PN475
And QEK arranges for the registration of the vehicle?---Correct.
PN476
And only some of the cars involved in these arrangements are actually built in Australia, aren't they?---Yes.
PN477
For example, the Holden, the Commodore, the Holden ute, the Statesman, are built here?---Correct.
PN478
But there is a range of cars that are imported from overseas?---Correct.
PN479
Including the Vectra, Barina, Astra - - -?---Correct.
PN480
All from Europe, the Rodeo from Japan, for example?---Correct.
PN481
And it is fair to say, is it not, that some of the cars that are ordered by employees may have been in Australia for a couple of months or more sitting on a wharf or a dock or in a holding yard somewhere?---Possibly.
PN482
Now, I want to focus on the work undertaken by the mechanical services area, Ms Carbin. We touched on that last time. The supervisor in the mechanical services area is a Mr McCraw?---Correct.
PN483
And the technicians that work in that area are a Mr Donnison, Mr Ilias and Mr Mazella, who work on the company vehicle fleet?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN484
Now, there is a pre-delivery inspection as you make reference to in your statement, and you made reference to in your oral evidence last time, and there is a Holden checklist which consists of about 120-odd items for that pre-delivery check. Is that correct?---Correct.
PN485
And as you said in your evidence last time, that inspection is designed to ensure that the vehicle conforms with the manufacturer's specifications, that it is roadworthy, that its engine is functioning correctly, that its electricals are functioning correctly, all of those sorts of things. That is correct, isn't it?---Correct.
PN486
And the inspection that is conducted as part of that pre-delivery process is designed to ascertain whether the vehicle is in need of repair?---Correct.
PN487
And therefore the inspection process is central to determining whether the vehicle itself is need of repair or otherwise. That is correct, isn't it?---Correct.
PN488
Now, repairs are often required, Ms Carbin, are they not, bearing in mind that you do minor repairs, but you facilitate and arrange for major repairs to be done out-of-house, so to speak?---Correct. However, we only do repairs on a very limited number of cars that we service, and once again that is just the company cars that are assigned to executives. All other vehicles are served at Holden retailers should they have a mechanical issue.
PN489
But it is all of those cars that are in the possession of Holden executives that you are responsible for repairing and servicing?---Correct.
PN490
And the repairs might go to things like cylinder misfiring or electronics being faulty, a whole range of electricals or computer matters of a minor nature you will deal with in-house?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN491
The technicians in the company vehicle fleet, that is what I am focusing on at the moment, will undertake those repairs?---Minor repairs.
PN492
And if the vehicle is in need of major repairs then it is the employees of QEK who arrange for the vehicle to be repaired by a tier two supplier?---Correct.
PN493
And that is done by way of the vehicle handling fleet coordinator who physically arranges for the vehicle to be repaired, who selects a - the vehicle coordinator in the fleet - the fleet coordinator in the vehicle handling area who gets quotes, who negotiates and who selects the tier two repairer?---For mechanical repairs?
PN494
Yes?---No.
PN495
Who is responsible for the mechanical repairs and arranging for those repairs to be done out-of-house?---Peter McCraw.
PN496
So the mechanical supervisor arranges for those repairs to be done out-of-house?---Correct.
PN497
And that would involve him, I take it, in getting quotes, negotiating with the relevant supplier or suppliers and selecting a supplier to undertake the repairs?---Yes.
PN498
And the paper work associated with those repairs is done by the fleet coordinators in the vehicle administration area, is it not?---No.
PN499
No?---It is done by Peter McCraw.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN500
So Peter McCraw negotiates and selects the supplier and then Peter McCraw deals with all of the paper work associated with the actual repairs? And when the vehicle comes back after being repaired who is responsible for inspecting the vehicle to ensure that the repairs are up to standard?---That would be Peter and his staff.
PN501
So that would be Mr McCraw and the technicians in the company vehicle fleet?---Correct.
PN502
Now, the technicians in the company vehicle fleet are also responsible, Ms Carbin, for fitting things like towbars and so forth, are they not?---Correct.
PN503
So if a Holden executive has ordered a Jackeroo or a Rodeo and they want a bull bar rather than a normal towbar, then that will be fitted in-house by the technicians?---Correct.
PN504
And indeed, at the Port Melbourne site, while you don't do this now, you have in the past actually fitted cruise control and air conditioning units to particular vehicles, have you not?---Not to my knowledge.
PN505
Not to your knowledge. You are not aware that that has previously been done, that that process is now undertaken by South City Holden?---Not to my knowledge.
PN506
After pre-delivery, Ms Carbin, the cars are detailed by detailers employed by QEK?---Correct.
PN507
And they wash and clean the cars and as you said in your evidence last time, they undertake minor repairs of the vehicles?---The detailers?
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN508
Minor repairs in terms of superficial scratches and things of that nature?---Can you clarify that question?
PN509
If I could take you to your evidence last time, Ms Carbin. You said on the last occasion in answer to a question that was put to you that the detailers undertake minor repairs of vehicles?---I don't recall saying that.
PN510
At paragraph 357 I asked you this:
PN511
What about work such as repairing minor scratches and so forth on the body work? Would they do that minor touch-up repair work?---Depending how minor; most of that is subject to our tier two vendor, but they would do some of that, yes,.
PN512
was your response. So I take it you don't resile from that evidence, some of those minor repairs would be done in-house by your detailers?---I can see that - well, you know what, it is a difference in the word and the understanding of the meaning of the word "repair", but fine, let us go forward; yes.
PN513
So you agree with that evidence?---Yes.
PN514
Yes. Now, if the body work of a car required major repair, that would again be arranged by QEK employees with a tier two supplier or suppliers?---Correct.
PN515
And I take it that would also be done by Mr McCraw?---Incorrect.
PN516
No, who would do the work in relation to the body work?---Vehicle handlers.
PN517
Vehicle handlers?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN518
Fleet coordinators in vehicle handling?---Correct.
PN519
Would that be done by Ms Kravelska, Ms Daniella Kravelska, who is a fleet coordinator in that area?---No.
PN520
No?---Daniella is a fleet coordinator in vehicle administration.
PN521
Yes?---Mm.
PN522
So it would be done by the fleet coordinators in the vehicle handling area, they would arrange for the body work repairs to be done?---Yes.
PN523
Yes?---In vehicle handling.
PN524
Okay. So they would negotiate with the tier two supplier and they would select the tier two supplier to undertake the work?---Correct.
PN525
And they would inspect the vehicle when it returns to ensure the repairs are up to standard?---Correct.
PN526
Now, the technicians in the company vehicle fleet also undertake servicing work as you have made clear from your statement and in your oral evidence, and there are in terms of the majority of the cars you said QEK, this is in your evidence previously:
PN527
QEK undertakes regular service but only to 10,000, usually only the first service.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN528
There have been cases, certainly have been cases, Ms Carbin, where cars have come in for servicing with 20 and 30,000 on the clock at QEK, have there not?---I actually don't see every repair order, so that is not - you know, I have a staff that manage the repair orders. I can't say with confidence, yes or no on that.
PN529
All right. Well, I am instructed that is the case, and you are really not in a position to disprove it?---I can't say yes or no on that.
PN530
And QEK does the servicing of the vehicles in the company vehicle fleet, that is the vehicles that are in the hands of the Holden executives?---Correct.
PN531
And it also has done some servicing of leased vehicles at times, has it not?---Once again I would have to say that because I don't see every repair order I can tell you that it is not something that we are - it is not in our scope of work to do that.
PN532
There are two Holden employees on site at QEK, Ms Carbin?---Yes.
PN533
Mr Lee, who is the company vehicle administrator?---Correct.
PN534
And a Mr Hepworth, who is the company vehicle manager?---That is correct.
PN535
And they have leased vehicles and those vehicles are serviced on the QEK premises by QEK employees. Are you aware of that?---There are - well, you know, they do have company cars. They would be eligible to have them serviced in our facility.
PN536
And they do have them serviced; are you aware of that?---Yes.
PN537
Now, the servicing is done in accordance with the Holden Owners Manual, which is the evidence you gave last time?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN538
And that requires things depending on what needs to be done to the car, the spark plugs may need to be replaced, the oil is changed, those sorts of things, the things you would expect to find in a sort of normal run of servicing?---Correct.
PN539
And all of those things are done, Ms Carbin, to restore the car to its optimum running condition. Would you agree with that?---Yes.
PN540
Now, repairs are also done as part of the servicing process, are they not? As part of the servicing process it may be seen that certain repairs are needed?---Yes.
PN541
And those minor repairs, as you said in your evidence, would be undertaken in-house; the more major repairs would go out-of-house?---Yes.
PN542
Are you aware that recently in terms of a repair that is perhaps not so minor, that there was a problem with a fuel gauge in a Commodore model and that petrol tanks had to be physically taken out of the cars to repair that problem? Are you aware of that?---Yes.
PN543
And that that work was done in-house in terms of the Holden Executive cars, are you aware of that?---I am actually not aware that it was either done in-house or tier-twoed. Appropriately, it should have been tier-twoed.
PN544
My instructions are it was done in-house in terms of the whole Holden vehicles and it was the company technicians in the vehicle fleet who removed the petrol tanks in order to correct the problem?---I cannot say yes or no to that.
PN545
And where a vehicle requires major repairs arising from the servicing process, I take it that would again be arranged by Mr McCraw?---Correct.
PN546
And of course those vehicles would be inspected on return, again by Mr McCraw, I take it, to ensure the work is up to standard?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN547
Now, the technicians in the company vehicle fleet, Ms Carbin, also pick up the work of the technician in the marketing fleet when that technician is on site. That is correct, isn't it?---No. You said on site?
PN548
Sorry, when the technician is off site?---Correct.
PN549
And it is true, is it not, that the technician in the marketing fleet could be off site at various locations for one or two or three weeks at a time?---The possibility exists. It hasn't occurred yet.
PN550
That technician travels Australia-wide for particular events and shows, does he not?---Correct.
PN551
And it is generally the case, isn't it, Ms Carbin, that marketing fleet cars - and these are the cars that are used at events, roadshows and so forth - will all be sent back to the QEK site in Port Melbourne after the event or the show?---Could you repeat it please? I am sorry.
PN552
It is the case, Ms Carbin, isn't it, that generally - as a general rule - marketing fleet cars after the event or the show or the particular occasion will be sent back to the QEK site in Port Melbourne?---Not always but sometimes, yes.
PN553
Well, would you agree generally that is the case?---Okay, yes.
PN554
Now, if those cars are sent back to Port Melbourne and the technician in the marketing fleet is not on site, any repairs that need to be done to those vehicles are done by the technicians in the company vehicle fleet at the time, are they not?---No.
PN555
No?---Not all repairs. Repairs would be sent out to providers, particularly on marketing fleet vehicles because they require a higher level of expertise.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN556
But the minor repairs would be done in-house by - - -?---Yes.
PN557
- - - the technicians in the company vehicle fleet?---Actually, there is only one technician that we usually use with marketing and that would be Wayne.
PN558
Right. That is Mr Donnison, is it?---Correct.
PN559
Okay, so that technician, who is in the company vehicle fleet, would work on the marketing fleet cars in terms of undertaking repairs in the absence of the marketing fleet technician?---Correct.
PN560
And again, as we have seen, major repairs would go out to the tier-two suppliers and presumably that would be organised by Mr McCraw?---Correct.
PN561
And the marketing fleet vehicles in terms of the mechanical servicing of those vehicles, including the repairs - - -?---Yes.
PN562
falls within the province of Mr McCraw as the mechanical supervisor?---Yes.
PN563
The technician in the marketing fleet, if I could move to this particular person, that is a Mr Vella?---Correct.
PN564
And that marketing fleet, as I have indicated earlier, is comprised of Holden cars used for marketing and promotional purposes. That is correct, isn't it?---Correct.
PN565
Used in shows and events, and an event can include the cars being put through their paces on the track. That is correct, isn't it?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN566
And there are also company vehicles used not just by Holden executives but by certain celebrities and VIPs. That is correct, isn't it?---Correct.
PN567
And those cars are also serviced at QEK?---Pending their disposition as far as geographical location, yes.
PN568
Yes. Now, that particular technician, Mr Vella, is involved in pre-delivery inspections, as you made clear in your witness statement. That is correct?---Correct.
[10.25am]
PN569
And again, that inspection is undertaken in accordance with the relevant Holden check list and the range of items specified therein? That is correct?---Correct.
PN570
And intrinsic to that inspection process, is the need to ascertain whether the vehicle was in need of repair? That is correct, isn't it?---Correct.
PN571
And that technician in the marketing fleet will undertake minor repairs as part of the pre-delivery function? That is correct?---Correct.
PN572
And again, we have the situation where the major repairs are arranged again by QEK employees n respect of tier-two supplies, and that is again, on the mechanical side, Mr McCraw. That is correct?---Correct.
PN573
And the - if the cars are in need of major work in terms of body work, does that responsibility fall to the - as with cars in the company vehicle fleet, does that responsibility fall to the fleet coordinators in the vehicle handling area?---Correct.
PN574
So they do the negotiations with the tier-two suppliers. They do all the paper work associated with it, and then there is an inspection of the vehicle when it returns?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN575
And the technician in the marketing fleet area also undertakes the vehicle servicing?---Correct.
PN576
Of the marketing fleet vehicles? And undertakes all of the minor repairs that flow from that servicing function?---Correct.
PN577
And when that particular technician is off-site, Ms Carbin, that technician undertakes mechanical inspections of vehicles prior to their use and events during and after an event; that is correct, isn't it?---Correct.
PN578
And if there are minor repairs needed to be done off site, the technician will undertake them? That is correct, isn't it?---Correct.
PN579
And again, if there are major repairs, it will be QEK employees that will arrange for those to be done through a tier-two supplier?---That is a question?
PN580
Yes, that is correct, isn't it?---That is correct.
PN581
And off-site events, for example, drive days, or the Melbourne Motor Show, to take two examples, or a photo shoot, for example, the technician in the marketing vehicle fleet is responsible for the integrity of the vehicle or vehicles off-site?---Yes.
PN582
Now, Ms Carbin, I just want to clarify with you what you say is involved in - in your witness statement you refer to, at page 6, in relation to the technician in the marketing fleet, you refer to - and I am here looking at dot point 5:
PN583
Up-fit and rectification of vehicles.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN584
Up-fit and rectification. What do you say is covered by up-fit and rectification, Ms Carbin?---Up-fit would be, for example, if you are going to put on an accessory that is not standard on the vehicle. So that would be up-fit. Rectification would be - it is kind of semantic that we use, for example, if there was panel damage on the car. We would have to rectify it to standard.
PN585
So you would have to - that would be the work - as you say, that is what the technician in the marketing fleet is responsible for. The up-fit and rectification includes rectification of panel work that is in need of repair, is that right?---And it is sub-let to a tier-two provider.
PN586
So are you saying there the technician in the marketing fleet would be responsible for having that work undertaken?---That would be, once again, the fleet coordinators for vehicle handling.
PN587
But when you are talking about up-fit and rectification, are you there talking about minor - further minor repairs that would be done to a vehicle that you effectively do in-house?---Can you repeat that?
PN588
You refer to up-fit and rectification of vehicles. Your evidence a moment ago was that rectification - rectification involves panel damage to a vehicle, for example?---Yes.
PN589
Yes?---Yes.
PN590
And you say that sort of damage goes out to a tier-two supplier?---Correct.
PN591
All right. That that the technician in the marketing fleet, doesn't have anything to do with that?---Panel repair?
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN592
Yes?---No.
PN593
All right. What I am asking you, you say the technician in the marketing fleet, this means approximately 30 per cent of that technician's time, is involved in up-fit and rectification of vehicles. Now I am asking you, what rectification work does the technician in the marketing fleet do?---I think what we are dealing with is the meaning of the term, rectification. Rectification in its broadest terms means bringing it back to standard. So that is the way I have used that in that testimony. So we would be bringing it back to standard.
PN594
Which may involve undertaking minor repairs to bring it back to standard?---Correct.
PN595
And the up-fit work can involve, for example, fitting a bull bar, replacing an existing, for example, replacing an existing bumper bar with an bull bar?---Correct.
PN596
And that requires drilling into the chassis and so forth, in order to attach the bull bar, does it not?---I actually don't do that work, so I wouldn't be qualified to answer that question.
PN597
Right. Well, I am instructed that is what it involves. You are not in a position to disagree with it?---I don't do that work.
PN598
Okay. And the detailers are also involved in respect of the marketing fleet?---Correct.
PN599
So, as your evidence was earlier, I take it they would wash and clean the cars and they would undertake minor repairs to vehicles?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN600
And the vehicle porters, as you said in your evidence earlier, that is last time, that they were constantly involved in moving vehicles based on the mechanical supervisor's direction?---Correct.
PN601
And that involves them moving vehicles that, as you said in your evidence last time, that are under repair, or to be repaired, or have been repaired?---Correct.
PN602
Now, I want to move to the vehicle handling area, Ms Carbin, in terms of the fleet coordinators. Now these staff are effectively the first port of call for clients and customers who come in with their vehicles?---Yes.
PN603
So if a person comes in for, say, a service or a change-over car, the fleet coordinator will organise it?---Correct.
PN604
And if the vehicle was in need of repair, including servicing, the fleet coordinator will take the car to mechanical services?---Correct.
PN605
And if the car has body damage, for example, and can't be repaired in-house, as you have said in your evidence, it is the fleet coordinators will arrange for the repairs to undertaken by tier-two suppliers That is correct?---Correct.
PN606
And if a vehicle is a superseded, Ms Carbin, and here I am referring to a vehicle that is the subject of a change-over. If that is superseded, the fleet coordinator will inspect the vehicle, and if it passes a visual inspection, the fleet coordinator will made a decision to either offer the car for sale to Holden employees, or to arrange for it to go to auction for sale; is that correct?---Correct.
PN607
And as you said in your evidence last time, if it is for auction sale, then QEK employees will arrange the logistics to get the car to the auction house; that is correct?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN608
Which is essentially Fowles' auction house; is that right?---Correct.
PN609
Now, if vehicles are offered for sale to Holden employees, Ms Carbin, then firstly QEK employees will undertake minor repairs on those vehicles, if needed?---They will coordinate for a tier-two provider.
PN610
Yes, or they will undertake the repairs if they are minor, and they will do them in-house?---Mechanical repair?
PN611
Mm?---Yes.
PN612
Yes. And if the major repairs are needed, QEK employees will arrange for the repairs to be undertaken by a tier-two provider?---Correct.
PN613
And that is again the province, I take it, of the fleet coordinator in the vehicle handling area?---Correct. I should share with you that we actually don't take cars back unless they meet standard.
PN614
Yes. Yes, no - I certainly appreciate that. And again, when the cars come back after major repair, it is the QEK employees who inspect the vehicle to ensure that the repairs have been done in accordance with the appropriate standard of repair? That is correct, isn't it?---That is correct.
PN615
And it is QEK employees that will arrange for a roadworthy certificate to obtained in relation to these vehicles that are going to be offered for sale to Holden employees? That is correct, isn't it?---That is correct.
PN616
And that is currently done - the roadworthy certificates are currently done externally, aren't they?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN617
And it is the QEK employees that arrange for those roadworthy certificates to be done externally in preparation for the vehicle for sale?---Correct.
PN618
And it is true, isn't it, that QEK is currently looking at bringing this function in-house?---Correct.
PN619
That is, being able to do the roadworthy certificates in-house?---Correct.
PN620
Which would, I take it, then involve your mechanics in the company vehicle fleet, undertaking the roadworthy checks and repairs in relation to these vehicles?---Correct.
PN621
And when the cars are taken out to have the roadworthy certificates done, which currently is done externally, they are taken out by the porters, the vehicle handling porters take the cars to wherever they need to go to have the roadworthy certificates issued?---Correct.
PN622
And it is true that the cars may be - these car may be detailed by QEK detailers?---Yes.
PN623
And then the cars are placed - they are actually displayed on your site in the used vehicle retailing area?---Yes.
PN624
And indeed QEK is responsible for updating the Holden bulletin board to advise Holden employees that vehicles are for sale; that is correct?---Correct.
PN625
And that is done twice weekly, is it not?---Once a week.
PN626
Once a week. So QEK updates the Holden bulletin to advise the Holden employees what vehicles are for sale on the QEK lot in Port Melbourne. That is correct?---That is correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN627
And QEK employees deal with inquiries form Holden employees, either in person or over the phone, in relation to vehicles that are for sale on the QEK lot?---Correct.
PN628
And indeed, you have a dedicated fleet coordinator who is responsible for used car sales and inquiries, and that is Ms Kravelska?---Correct.
PN629
And if the cars are sold, then all of the sales documentation is prepared by QEK employees?---Correct.
PN630
And in particular it is done by Ms Kravelska, is it not?---Correct.
PN631
And QEK as part of that sale process accept payment for the sale price from the employee?---Correct.
PN632
Including on-road costs, which are then forwarded by QEK to VicRoads?---Correct.
PN633
And it is fair to say, isn't it, Ms Carbin, that on average you would sell on average about four to five used cars from your site each week?---Yes.
PN634
And indeed you play a role - QEK plays a central role in new vehicle sales to Holden employees, does it not?---We administer the paper work.
PN635
Yes. So you verify that the respective purchaser is a current Holden employee?---Correct.
PN636
You verify that that purchaser as a Holden employee, is eligible to purchase the vehicle?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN637
You determine whether the employee remains eligible based on the, for example, the number of vehicles purchased by him or her over a period of time?---Correct.
PN638
And you prepare the sale documentation in the name of Holden, but prepared by you, and a letter of introduction for the employee to the relevant dealership that he or she wishes to purchase the car from. That is correct, isn't it?---Sale documentation, I am not familiar with what you are referring to there. I do know that we do prepare the letter of introduction.
PN639
And you prepare the documents relating to the sale of the vehicle on behalf of Holden?---Actually the sale of the vehicle takes place at the Holden retailer. They would have to do sale documentation.
PN640
I see. And, Ms Carbin, the undertaking of servicing, including repairs by QEK, both in-house and outside of house, that QEK facilitates, is no doubt all included in the price charge to Holden by QEK, is it not?---can you repeat the question?
PN641
QEK in charging Holden for the services it provides, factors into that charge the cost of repair of vehicles, both in-house, that are done in-house and externally, in terms of arranging for that to be done?---Are you asking the question?
PN642
Yes, yes?---So please say it again.
PN643
I will see if I can make it clearer. Holden, as part of your agreement with Holden, I take it part of the price that is paid by Holden for your services, includes the cost of you undertaking minor repairs of in-house vehicles, and arranging for repairs out of house?---Yes.
PN644
Yes. And in South Australia, Ms Carbin, you also employ fleet coordinators?---Yes.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN XXN MR A. LAWRENCE
PN645
You also employ a porter?---Yes.
PN646
And you also employ a detailer?---Yes.
PN647
Yes. Thank you, Ms Carbin, I have no further questions.
PN648
PN649
MR B. LAWRENCE: Ms Carbin, you have been asked a number of questions about repairs that are carried out, and the difference between major and minor repairs. From time to time there has been reference to panel beating, damaged panels on vehicles. What is the practice in relation to repairs to panel damage, repairs to panels?---All repairs to panels are sent out to a tier-two provider.
PN650
Yes. And in relation to the detailers and the detailing work that is done, you were taken to some work that the detailers do, prior to the final disposition of the car. What work do the detailers do over the life cycle of the car, if I could put it that way, from the time that the car first arrives until the time that it is disposed of?---Well, upon receipt and prior to exchange to a customer, they would of course clear it and detail it so that it is deliverable to the customer. And during in-service we don't get involved in any of the detailing, and we don't maintain those. The only other time would be at disposal, if it was an actual used car sale.
PN651
All right, now in answering my question, you referred to customers?---Yes.
PN652
When you use the customer term, what do you mean by that? Who are the customers?---The customers would be Holden employees.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN653
And are these customers who would receive the car under the company vehicle fleet arrangements or by way of a lease, or by some other means?---Correct.
PN654
Yes, all right, well just take the three of them?---Yes.
PN655
The - Holden make available cars to - amongst other senior executives?---Yes.
PN656
Is that right?---Yes.
PN657
And it is part of their salary packaging arrangements, or their remuneration - - -?---Correct.
PN658
- - - arrangement?---Correct.
PN659
And when they receive - in their capacity of receiving a car there, are you referring to them as customers?---Yes.
PN660
Yes?---Oh, yes.
PN661
All right. Now another way on which you have touche don this in your evidence, another way in which a Holden employee may receive a car is by way of a lease arrangement?---Correct.
PN662
And is that a formal lease that I entered into, or is it some other arrangement?---They have what is called - Holden has what they call a lease agreement which the employee enters into with holden.
PN663
Yes. And under that lease agreement, who becomes a registered owner?---Holden.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN664
Yes. Yes?---It is more, actually kind of like a glorified renting agreement.
PN665
Yes?---The asset always remains in Holden's ownership.
PN666
And do the employees pay for the benefit and use of the car under that arrangement?---Yes. Yes.
PN667
All right. So there are two ways in which you find customers. There are two categories of customers. There other categories of customers, are there?---We have what we would call, company car drivers. We have job related vehicle drivers. We have extended lease drivers, standard lease drivers.
PN668
All right?---Those are the categories.
PN669
All right. Well, just take the job related drivers?---Yes.
PN670
Were they included within the customers category that you used before?---Every category I just gave you is considered a customer.
PN671
Yes?---Everybody that we work with is considered a customer.
PN672
All right. Now if I could just take the job related drivers?---Yes.
PN673
What does that term encompass? What does it mean?---Okay, a job related vehicle driver would be a driver who has been given the vehicle by Holden as a tool of trade. So that they can go out, for example, and call on retail Holden dealers> Because you will have what is called a Zone Office, and the people in the zone office are there to service the retailers. And so the job related vehicle allows them to do that effectively.
[10.50am]
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN674
And are these employees sometimes or always entitled to use the car for private purposes, for private use?---Yes.
PN675
Sometimes or always do you know?---Oh, it is not always.
PN676
Yes, thank you. Now, in regard to the ownership of vehicles, does Holden remain the owner of all of the vehicles that you have referred to?---Absolutely.
PN677
And approximately how many vehicles are there in this scheme that is administered by you?---6000.
PN678
And do you know what the split is between marketing and non-marketing vehicles?---Sure. Marketing vehicles are comprised of a fleet of 200 and - right now, 290 vehicles. The balance is all of company vehicle operation.
PN679
And those - the balance of the 6000 or so, do you know approximately what proportion of those are regarded as - termed leased?---All but 450 are termed leased vehicles.
PN680
And these are the leased vehicles made available to Holden employees?---Correct.
PN681
And when a lease is entered into is it for a fixed period of time?---Yes.
PN682
And is it related in any way to the number of kilometres the vehicle might travel?---Yes.
PN683
So it is time and distance-related, is it?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN684
And what is the normal time and the normal distance for these leased vehicles?---Okay. Each lease scheme is governed by a separate policy. So if you have a standard lessee it is six months, 10,000 kilometres. An extended lessee would be 18 months. We try to keep it below 40,000 kilometres. That is all driven by Holden.
PN685
Yes. And in regard to the leased vehicles, they go to a particular employee, correct?---Correct.
PN686
And there has been reference to the purchase of vehicles by Holden employees. Does the Holden employee who leases the vehicle sometimes purchase that particular vehicle?---Yes.
PN687
And in that case what is the process for the purchase of the vehicle?---The vehicle would have to be returned. It would be inspected because it has actually been returned to the company vehicle fleet. We would do a thorough inspection and prior to that, if the customer was really interested in purchasing that car they would actually kind of, what we call, put a reservation on it so that they would have an opportunity to purchase it at the completion of the lease.
PN688
And who would it be purchased by - who would it be purchased from?---Holden.
PN689
Yes. And you have referred to, in the course of your evidence today, the paperwork or the steps that are taken. Do those steps apply in relation to the purchase by the employee of that vehicle from Holden?---Yes.
PN690
So you gave evidence about sale through auction, what proportion of the company vehicles, approximately, what proportion of the company vehicles, including the leased vehicles, are sold at auction ultimately?---95 per cent.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN691
Yes. And if I could take you to the 5 per cent that are not sold at auction. Are they the ones that are either reserved by the driver under a lease arrangement or sold by way of that process that you referred to earlier today where they are on site and they are advertised and they are sold to employees?---Yes. They are either sold to employees or - because of - they can be totalled while in service if people have severe enough accidents. So we have a percentage of the fleet that will end up being scrapped.
PN692
Yes. The scrapped proportion are in that 5 per cent?---Yes.
PN693
Yes. Thank you. Now, in relation to the auction process, you referred in the course of your evidence to the logistics of the sale - - -?---Yes.
PN694
- - - through auction. What is the responsibility of your company in getting the cars to auction?---We just actually place a phone call to Holden Logistics and we ask them - if we are not getting our trucks on time, because it is a relationship between Holden and a company called Toll Transport - - -
PN695
Toll. T-o-l-l?---T - yes. And if we are not getting the trucks that we need to get the vehicles to auction we place a call to GM Logistics and we inform them that we are in a delay pattern and that we need them to contact Toll and make them aware that we need trucks.
PN696
But leaving aside that particular problem, if things go to plan, would the Toll truck transporter come to - - -?---Yes.
PN697
- - - your premises and take cars away? Yes. And does the company, your company have any responsibility once the car is placed on the Toll truck to be taken away?---No.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN698
And the paperwork, what is the end line of the paperwork in that process as far as QEK is concerned?---It is called a VSR, it is a Vehicle Survey Report, and we just - whenever a vehicle is transported that transport company fills out an inspection on that car and we sign, as to agree, that that was the disposition of the vehicle at the time of transport.
PN699
And what happens to that form?---A copy of it gets filed in our records.
PN700
Yes. And the other one?---Goes to Fowles.
PN701
Goes to?---Fowles, to the auction.
PN702
Fowles, yes. And which company - or which companies enter into the arrangement with Fowles for the auction?---Holden.
PN703
Holden, yes. And what is the process for QEK notifying Holden that the vehicles have gone to Fowles?---We are working on a Holden system and we update the system. So it is a manual - it is an electronic data entry.
PN704
Yes. So you do it electronically, it is an electronic communication for Holden?---Yes. Yes.
PN705
Thank you. Now, you referred in your evidence to the word "porters", you were asked various questions about the word "porters" on the last occasion and it was touched on again today. And you were asked questions about - or a question about the porters moving the cars in and out of workshops or in connection with repairs. What kind of work do porters do? What range of work? When would they be called upon?---Porters are specifically - that might be a term from America - but they are drivers, they basically move a unit to the next point in the process. They physically move assets, yes.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN706
So in this process that you are involved in, in this asset management process, when do they first get involved?---At point of receipt of the vehicle. So that would be when the truck drops the vehicle off from the plant. Is it possible that I could go to the bathroom?
PN707
THE COMMISSIONER: Yes, we can adjourn - - -?---I am sorry.
PN708
That is fine. We can adjourn for five minutes?---Thank you.
SHORT ADJOURNMENT [11.02am]
RESUMED [11.07am]
PN709
MR B. LAWRENCE: Ms Carbin, I just wanted to briefly take you to something that you were taken to on the previous occasion. This was in relation to the customer service centre and you might recall that you were asked about the customer service centre and then it appeared that you and Mr Lawrence were at cross purposes because there was some reference to the customer service centre supervisor?---Yes.
PN710
And Mr Lawrence was asking you questions about the customer service centre supervisor and you were answering about the centre itself. Could I just take you briefly to that and ask you how many people work in the customer service centre? How many people are located in the customer service centre?---About 15.
PN711
Yes. And in general terms what is the function of the customer service centre?---The customer service centre kind of, just does that. We answer - we communicate with our customers via phone, fax and e-mail and what we do is we provide the answers to their questions in relationship to their lease schemes, their company cars, whatever queries they might have, if they are eligible - about policy.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN712
And which particular groups of employees work outside the customer service centre?---The mechanics and the - the mechanical supervisor.
PN713
All right. Now, could I take you to the evidence that you gave today. First of all you were asked some questions about the licensed motor car trader arrangements. Is QEK a licensed motor car trader?---No.
PN714
In regard to the leased vehicles, if there is an accident, if the employee has an accident, what are the arrangements for the repair of that vehicle? Who is responsible?---Well, the employee, according to the Holden Company Vehicle Operators' Handbook, is responsible to get the vehicle properly towed and then it would go to a tier-two provider for proper repair.
PN715
And does that apply to both major and minor repairs?---Correct.
PN716
Now, you have referred to minor repairs being carried out by QEK personnel. Which vehicles are the subject of those minor repairs by QEK?---Minor repairs would be provided for the company vehicle fleet which is - I am talking about the company cars that are driven by the executives and/or the marketing fleet, those marketing units.
PN717
So in general terms how many of the total vehicles of 6000 or so would be in those two categories that would be the subject of minor repairs being done at QEK?---450 for company vehicle fleet, 290 for marketing, so you are all-up around 700 cars.
PN718
About 7 - - -?---700.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN719
Yes, thank you. Now, in relation to cars such as Jackaroos and Rodeos that we have referred to earlier, what are the arrangements - well, first of all, do they fall into the category where minor repairs would be done in-house or are they outside that category?---The - the Jackaroos, for example, are not - they are not an eligible unit in the fleet. There are times when we received them because of plant stock issues but the only people who would be driving those would be a minor amount of executives. The relationship with IGM is that they actually get their vehicles serviced at retailers so - - -
PN720
Sorry. If I could just stop you. They said IGM, the relationship with IGM?---Yes.
PN721
IGM stands for?---Well, IGM product. IGM product is serviced - - -
PN722
IGM stands for?---Isuzu - now, I am embarrassed. I think it is Isuzu General Motors - - -
PN723
Well, perhaps I could lead you on this. You are talking about International General Motors?---Okay. That is very embarrassing. Sorry.
PN724
Yes. These are non-Holden products?---Correct.
PN725
Yes. Non-Holden manufactured products but within the GM group, is that right?---Correct.
PN726
Yes. And where are those products serviced - where are those vehicles serviced? These are the non-Holden - - -?---IGM locations.
PN727
And not - other than QEK?---The people from IGM who drive Holden vehicles get their vehicles serviced at an IGM dealer. When we do get the occasional Jackaroo into the fleet it would be - it would be serviced with us.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN728
Now, you were asked questions about Mr Lee and Mr Hepworth and there was reference to their vehicles and where their vehicles are serviced. Do you know in what category their vehicles are, of the variety of categories?---I know - I know Mr Hepworth. I am sorry, I don't know Mr Lees because I actually don't get - I have staff who maintain those. I believe Mr Hepworth has a - I know that he has a company car and I believe he has a lease car - I am not quite sure. I know he has a standard lease and potentially an extended lease. We would have to check the records.
PN729
Thank you. But if he had a company car would it be - would its minor repairs be attended to by QEK?---Yes.
PN730
Yes. If an employee, a Holden employee, indicated a desire to buy a vehicle, either one that he or she had driven or one that he or she became aware of, what - and QEK received notice of that. What would be the process from thereon in for the sale of the vehicle by Holden to that person?---Okay. So if the car was still in service, meaning being driven by someone, we would do - we would put what is called a tag form in the hard file on that car. When the vehicle is returned we check the hard file to see if there are any tag forms and then if there are we contact that person who is interested in the vehicle, tell them that the vehicle is available and, you know, they come down, they take a look at it. If they decide that they want to purchase it then we go through the used car process.
PN731
And what is that?---What that entails is - Holden provides QEK with all of the information regarding the vehicle and the pricing of the vehicle and we take that information and place it into various documents on behalf of Holden in order to complete the sale of behalf of Holden.
PN732
Yes, thank you. Now, you were asked about letters of introduction?---Correct.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN733
These are letters that a Holden employee would take to a dealer. What is the process for the preparation of a letter of introduction and what is the involvement of QEK in that process?---Okay. A letter of introduction is just what it says. It is to introduce the employee to a Holden retailer. What our purpose is in that is we actually - the customer comes in, asks for a letter of introduction. We will go into the Holden data bases and determine whether or not that employee is eligible to have a letter of introduction. Once we determine that we will then complete the letter of introduction and provide that to them.
PN734
And having provided that letter of introduction to them do you have any more to do with the process?---Yes. Because we will - once they go to the dealership and they decide, I think, what vehicle they want then we can actually allocate that vehicle to the dealer stock.
PN735
Yes. And that would be by way of communication to Holden, would it?---Absolutely.
PN736
Yes. And then Holden would facilitate that - - -?---Absolutely.
PN737
- - - the delivery of that vehicle?---Absolutely. And it just becomes out of our hands.
PN738
Sorry?---Then it just gets out of our hands.
PN739
Yes. If a Holden employee leaves Holden's employment while being in the possession of one of these vehicles under whichever plan might be applicable, what is the process insofar as it involves QEK?---Holden Human Resources will notify us that the employee will be leaving the employ of Holden and then we contact the employee and make arrangements for that employee to bring the vehicle back because they are no longer eligible in the scheme.
**** BARBARA JADE CARBIN FXN MR B. LAWRENCE
PN740
And if or when the employee brings the car back do you do a check of a kind that you referred to earlier in your evidence?---Yes.
PN741
Yes. I have no further questions.
PN742
PN743
MR A. LAWRENCE: Commissioner, based on what the Commission has heard last time, it seems clear that there are two issues that divide the parties here. Firstly is the issue of authority, and secondly, the issue of QEK employs anyone who falls within the eligibility rules of the AMWU. Now, if I can go to the issue of authority, first. This, in my submission is clear cut. The power resides in the - I took the Commission to the relevant rules last time. Does the Commission wish me to take it to the particular rules again?
PN744
THE COMMISSIONER: No.
PN745
MR A. LAWRENCE: No. I will make reference to the rules in passing without going directly to them, Commissioner. The power resides in the Vehicle Division Conference, and between meetings of the conference, the Vehicle Division is, we say, to serve logs of claims. Rule 50.7 in the rules is a general power, which resides in the National Conference of the Vehicle Division, and it is exercisable, subject to the rules and the decision of the National Conference.
PN746
But the rule goes on to provide that the Vehicle Division National Conference:
PN747
... shall have the management and control of the affairs of the Vehicle Division.
PN748
That general power, in my submission, without question, extends to the service of letters of demand and logs of claims at a minimum on behalf of the Division. Rule 50A deals with the Vehicle Division Executive, and it is clear that the Vehicle Division Executive has between meetings of the Vehicle Division Conference, all of the powers of that Vehicle Division Conference. And rule 50A, as in the following terms, 50A sets out the composition of the Vehicle Division executive, and it then goes on at 50(e):
PN749
The Federal Executive shall, when the Vehicle Division Conference is not in session, subject to the decisions of the National Conference ...(reads)... all the powers of the Vehicle Division Conference.
PN750
Rule 50.12 deals with the powers of the Federal Secretary of the Vehicle Division. And there really, in my submission, is no need to go any further than this in terms of the requisite authority to serve the letter of demand and log of claims in this case. That is, the letter of demand and log of claims that was served by the AMWU on QEK on the, from memory, 27 June - 27 June this year. So the power resides in the National Conference of the Vehicle Division. In between national conferences, that general power is exercised by the Vehicle Division Executive, and the Federal Secretary of the Vehicle Division is authorised to serve a letter of demand and log of claims, in my submission, under the rules, and particularly at rule 50 sub-rule 12.
PN751
The Commission will note that the Federal Secretary of the Vehicle Division holds office as Assistant National Secretary of the Union and performs the duties of Assistant National Secretary under these rules. Implements the decisions of the national conferences, national council and national administrative - I am here looking at 12G:
PN752
Budget committee, federal conference of the Vehicle Division, and Federal Executive of the Vehicle Division. The Federal Secretary shall under ...(reads)... only more than one State.
PN753
And there is a power to enter into industrial agreements on behalf of the Vehicle Division under 12K. Now, in my submission there is ample authority in the rules for the service of the log of claims and letter of demand in this case. That is the letter of demand and log of claims we served on 27 June this year. At a minimum, we say, in terms of what constitutes the Vehicle Division. At a minimum it consists of all persons who are members, or eligible to be members of the Union pursuant to sub-clause 1E, at a minimum. And I don't think there is a dispute between the parties about that.
PN754
Now there is, under rule 54, which I took the Commission to last time, an enabling rule at the time of amalgamation which determined who was to go into the division. But for the present purposes, the central concern is who are eligibility members of the Vehicle Division at the present time, and we say, at a minimum, that is determined by reference to sub-clause 1E of the rules. Now, if one looks at what has occurred to date in this matter, there has been the service of a letter of demand and log of claims by the AMWU through the agency of the Vehicle Division. That particular letter of demand was served by Mr Jones, as I said earlier, on 27 June. And it was served for and on behalf of the AMWU Vehicle Division.
PN755
Importantly, the letter of demand, contrary to what Ms Carbin says in her witness statement is not confined to Victoria. The letter of demand is served generally on QEK in respect of all employees who are engaged to work in, or in connection with the vehicle industry and who are eligible for membership of the AMWU, whether such employees are members of the AMWU or not. Now, that log of claims has been served and the demands have not been acceded to.
PN756
In evidence in AMWU1, there is, Commissioner, the statement signed by Mr Jones, which states that he has the knowledge - I am looking at paragraph 2 here of the statement signed by Mr Jones on 9 July 2003. This is exhibit AMWU1. Included in exhibit AMWU1. Mr Jones states that he has knowledge of the facts in this matter and he is authorised by the National Executive of the AMWU Vehicle Division to make a statement:
PN757
The National Executive of AMWU Vehicle Division, paragraph 3, authorises serving of the letter of demand and the log of claims served on the employer set out ...(reads)... was effected by registered post on 27 June 2003.
PN758
And those claims, at paragraph 6 he notes, have not been acceded to. Now that is the evidence going to authorisation, and in addition the Commission will be aware that the union has provided the minutes of the relevant Federal Executive meeting of the Vehicle Division in respect of the decision to serve the log of claims on QEK and other companies. Commissioner, the decision which I referred to in my opening last time, that is the decision of the High Court in Attorney-General for the State of Queensland v Riordan, which is cited at paragraph 17 of our outline, stands for the proposition, amongst others, that:
PN759
... provided a demand is genuine, the service of a log of claims and a failure or refusal to accede to the demands, is sufficient evidence of the existence of an industrial dispute.
PN760
There is no question raised in these proceedings by the respondent going to the issue of genuineness. No question raised at all. And there is no evidence before this Commission to suggest that the letter of demand and the log of claims in this matter was served without authorisation. In my submission, QEK carries the onus of establishing that the log of claims served on 27 June this year by the AMWU through the Vehicle Division was served without authorisation. And that onus has simply not been discharged. The presumption of regularity that is established by the material filed by the Union, in particular the statement of Mr Jones, and the minutes filed on behalf of the Union, has not been displaced.
PN761
Now can I then deal with the scope of the dispute? At a minimum we say, the scope of the dispute extends to and encompasses all persons eligible to be members of the AMWU pursuant to rule 1 of the AMWU's eligibility rule. That is our primary position and we maintain it. But it is perfectly open to the Commission, in my submission, to find that the scope of the dispute is between the AMWU (Vehicle Division) and QEK. And that would involve employees of QEK who are eligible to be members of the AMWU pursuant to sub-rule 1E.
PN762
Now we say, Commissioner, the evidence clearly establishes that there are a number of employees employed by QEK that are eligible for membership of the AMWU pursuant to sub-rule 1E of the AMWU's eligibility rule. Commissioner, the - I will be guided by the Commission's view about this, but the AMWU currently has members at QEK, which has a number of members. We are - we would be prepared to provide the names of those members to the Commission should it wish to see them on a confidential basis. And to my learned friend on a confidential basis, that is not to be disclosed to his client. If the Commission is of the view that that would be of assistance to it in this matter, we are prepared to embark on that case.
PN763
THE COMMISSIONER: Well, that would only be of assistance to the Commission, I suggest, if it is challenged by the other side, as to whether there is members or not.
PN764
MR B. LAWRENCE: Commissioner, we believe that there weren't members. Mr Lawrence mentioned to me during the break earlier today that they have members or they claim members. I haven't had a chance to get instructions on that. But it seems to me that the resolution of the issues before the Commission really don't depend upon whether there are members or not. This is really a question of whether or not a dispute can be created, in a relative way. I wouldn't expect these members, if their names were known, to be prejudiced in any way by the disclosure of their membership.
PN765
But as I said, I don't think we need to get to that point. I don't think I would really need to get instructions on it. We have got an argument that we have foreshadowed in relation to the nature of the dispute, and whether there are members or not - - -
PN766
THE COMMISSIONER: It doesn't go to it.
PN767
MR B. LAWRENCE: It doesn't matter as far as we are concerned. Even if there were members there in a number of the classifications.
PN768
THE COMMISSIONER: Thank you for that.
PN769
MR A. LAWRENCE: We are content with that course, Commissioner.
PN770
THE COMMISSIONER: Yes.
PN771
MR A. LAWRENCE: The starting point then in relation to this particular aspect of the disagreement between the parties, Commissioner, in my submission is sub-rule 1E. And if I can take the Commission to sub-rule 1E. The Commission will see, and - does the Commission have the sub-rule 1E as it appears now, as a result of the decision of Senior Deputy President Williams in July?
PN772
THE COMMISSIONER: I have the document that you tendered to me, I think, and it is - I thought it was dated but I can't now see the date - 12 June.
PN773
MR A. LAWRENCE: Twelfth of June?
PN774
THE COMMISSIONER: Mm.
PN775
MR A. LAWRENCE: Well, if the Commission goes to - perhaps the Commission would be better to work off AMWU5, which is the current eligibility rule attached to the decision of Senior Deputy President Williams.
PN776
THE COMMISSIONER: I have that one.
PN777
MR A. LAWRENCE: This is the rule as it currently stands. It is about four pages in from the back.
PN778
THE COMMISSIONER: Yes.
PN779
MR A. LAWRENCE: Just near the top of the page.
PN780
THE COMMISSIONER: Yes.
PN781
MR A. LAWRENCE: Now, this is the crux of the matter. The Commission will see:
PN782
Without in any way limiting or being limited by sub-rules 1A, B, C, D, F, G, H and I, the Union shall also consist of an unlimited number of employees engaged in or usually engaged in the process, trade or business, connected with or incidental to ...
PN783
And those are words of extension. And in terms of the eligibility, and there is, I don't think, any disagreement between the parties on the relevant principles that apply to the interpretation and construction of union eligibility rules. We make reference to that in paragraph 8 of our outline of submissions, that those expressions are ones of wide scope, and indeed are words of extension that is in connection with or incidental to the manufacture, assembling or repairing of a range of vehicles, including motor cars. And importantly, the rule goes on in its amended form, and the preparation for sale of motor vehicles, pre-delivery, and sale by auction of any motor vehicle.
PN784
Now in my submission it is crucial in terms of determining whether a QEK employee falls within the scope of sub-rule 1E, to look not at what QEK says it does, but to look at what the duties are of the employees concerned. What duties, what work are the employees undertaking? And the question is whether that work, if you take the first limb of sub-rule 1E, that is work of an employee who is engaged or usually engaged in the process, trade or business connected with or incidental to.
PN785
So it is not necessary that the employee be involved directly with repairing. It is enough that the employee be involved in connection with or incidental to the repairing of motor vehicles. And it is enough that the particular employee be involved in connection with or incidental to the preparation for sale of motor vehicles, or sale by auction. And it is clear, and established on the authorities, as I said, Commissioner, that those words are words of extension; that is, in connection with, or incidental to.
PN786
Now we say there are a range of QEK employees who fall within the scope of sub-rule 1E without question, on the evidence. They are engaged in the process or trade connected with or incidental to the repairing of motor vehicles and/or the preparation for sale of motor vehicles. And if I can deal with what I might term the first limb initially. The definition of "repair" contained in the Oxford Dictionary Second Edition is as follows:
PN787
The act of restoring to a sound or unimpaired condition; the process by which that is accomplished; the result attained.
PN788
The act of restoring to a sound or unimpaired condition. Now, who are the relevant employees that fall within sub-rule 1E? We say first of all, there is no question that the technicians in the company vehicle fleet fall clearly within sub-rule 1E. They are qualified motor mechanics. That is the evidence of Ms Carbin, at paragraph 215. They conduct pre-delivery inspections. That is the evidence of Ms Carbin this morning, and previously at paragraph 217, to ensure a whole range of things. That vehicles conform with manufacturer specifications. The vehicle is roadworthy, the engine is functioning correctly, electricals functioning correctly. In effect, everything works on the vehicle. And QEK employs motor mechanics, because of these sorts of functions.
PN789
And if one goes to the witness statement of Ms Carbin, Ms Carbin says that the technicians in the company vehicle fleet spend approximately 80 per cent of their time in doing pre-delivery inspections. And her evidence today was that inspections are undertaken to ascertain whether the vehicle is in need of repair. So the inspection is intrinsic to the repair function, in my submission. And that is established on the evidence. In addition to that, the evidence establishes that these technicians service vehicles, they are involved in changing oil, spark plugs, tuning vehicles, all work, in my submission, that is designed to restore the vehicle to a sound or unimpaired condition. And again, that was the evidence of Ms Carbin this morning. All work designed in respect of the repairing of the vehicle in terms of the definition of "repair".
PN790
For example, an engine may not be running properly; it is impaired. It is tuned. The impairment is therefore taken away. It is repaired. Brakes may be functioning in an impaired way because they need adjustment. There are adjusted or repaired. These functions fall within the definition of repairing. In addition to that, the evidence establishes that the technicians actually undertake minor repairs in-house. Further, there are repairs involved in changing over particular parts of vehicles, whether it might be putting on a bull bar, as was stated in the evidence. Drilling into a chassis.
PN791
In my submission, that is a restoration function. And if you look at the primary - on Ms Carbin's own evidence, if you look at the primary functions of a technician in a company vehicle fleet, pre-delivery inspections, which are intrinsic to the repair function, on the evidence, clearly established on the evidence. completing vehicle services. Again, part of the repair function, and undertaking of repairs. There is no question, in my submission, that these technicians are in employed directly in repairing motor cars, but at a minimum they are employed in or in connection with, or incidental to repairing motor vehicles.
PN792
And it is simply not relevant, in my submissions, that QEK says, well, we are in the business of asset management, we are not in the business of repairing motor vehicles, it is simply not relevant. What needs to be looked at is the actual work undertaken by the employees, the duties that they undertake. And even one were to concede that point, which we don't, then the authorities clearly establish that you can be - as an employer, you can be involved in more than one business. And that is made clear in our outline.
PN793
But when you look at taking the technicians in the company fleet first, when you look at what they actually do, there is no question, in my submission, and as I have said, this is clearly established on the evidence, that they are directly involved in the repair function, or they are employed in connection with or incidental to it. The technician in a marketing fleet again is a qualified motor mechanic. That is the evidence of Ms Carbin at paragraph 243 and following. Again the technician in the marketing fleet undertakes pre-delivery inspections; inspections that are intrinsic to the repair function, again on the evidence.
PN794
I don't need to labour this. Undertake servicing. Undertakes repairs both on site and off site. And is involved in mechanical inspections following utilisation at an event, which, on the evidence means, inspecting in terms of ascertaining whether the vehicle is in need of repair or not. So there is simply no question that all of the technicians, both in the company vehicle fleet and the marketing fleet, in my submission, fall within the scope of sub-rule 1E, and are eligible to be members of the AMWU pursuant to that sub-rule.
PN795
We then move to the supervisor of the mechanical services. That supervisor, Mr McCraw was responsible for the mechanical team and its performance. That person coordinates the training of the mechanics. That is Ms Carbin's evidence at paragraph 272. And it is those mechanics, as we have seen, who undertake the repair function. That supervisor undertakes supervisory work in respect of the repair function and is therefore both directly involved in the repair function, or is involved in the repairing of motor vehicles in connection with or incidental to that repairing.
PN796
And in addition, as established on the evidence this morning, it is that person that arranges for vehicles to be repaired, mechanically repaired, outside of QEK. So you have got a number of levels of repair work being done here. You have got QEK employees who are involved in direct repairs through repairing including the servicing function, and then you have employees including the supervisor in mechanical services, who is involved in and responsible for ensuring that repairs are done outside of QEK. And that is the person that negotiates quotes. That is the person who selects the repairer. So there is no question that that person is intrinsically involved in the process or trade of repairing. No question, in my submission, on the evidence.
[11.50am]
PN797
That mechanical services supervisor supervises the repair function in-house and arranges for the repairs to be undertaken out of house and that is clearly established on the evidence and in my submission it doesn't stop there. The porters in the vehicle handling area, on the evidence, their duties are to move vehicles based on the mechanical supervisor's direction. That is at paragraph 352 of the transcript. They move vehicles either undergoing repair or that have been repaired or are going to be repaired or serviced. That is at paragraph 353 and again we went to that issue this morning. These are their duties and on that basis, in my view, it is simply irrefutable that they are engaged in the process connected with or incidental to the repairing of motor vehicles. There is a direct and immediate connection between the two.
PN798
PN799
MR A. LAWRENCE: This was a case going to construction of an eligibility rule in relation to chemical workers and it was a question as to whether gatekeepers who were employed in a chemical plant, or employed in connection with chemical workers. And on page 387 the Commission will see the Full Court of the Commonwealth Industrial Court, the relevant constitution rule. That is at about point 5 on page 387:
PN800
A description of the industry in connection with which the union is registered is as follows...
PN801
and it goes down:
PN802
...undertakers, workers, chemical workers, persons employed as dentists...
PN803
and so on. And the issue was that respondent employer - employees engaged in distilleries such as a gatekeeper or a watchman. And that is on paragraph 390, Commissioner, at the last paragraph of 390. And if you go to paragraph 391, to the second last full paragraph, you will see there Spicer CJ and Smithers J say this:
PN804
The question is whether, for instance, the gatekeeper and the watchman ...(reads)... materials regarded as chemicals.
PN805
And then they go on:
PN806
They may be said to be employed by the respondent company in connection with the industry ...(reads)... with respect to the work of chemical workers as such.
PN807
That is, has the required significance with respect to the work of chemical workers given the "in connection with" aspect of the rule. Here we say if you look at the role of porters they have - they clearly have the required significance with respect to the work of repairing. And if you go to paragraph - page 394, Commissioner, at point 5. You see there:
PN808
The test, therefore, with respect to the workers who are not themselves chemical workers is ...(reads)... the work of all the chemical and other workers is directed.
PN809
Now, if one applies that to this case the test is whether the workers, for example the porters, where there is some factor in the nature and quality of the work performed having immediate significance and relation to the work of repairing. And there is no question in my submission that the work of the porters in relation to repairing has the immediate significance and relation to that work. They are involved in the movement of cars that are either to be repaired, under repair or have been repaired.
PN810
The same can be said, in my submission, in relation to detailers employed by QEK. They wash and clean the cars and they undertake minor repairs of those cars. And as such we say they are engaged in the process and trade of repairing motor vehicles, or they are engaged in connection with or incidental to. The range of employees extends further, in my submission, to fleet co-ordinators in the vehicle handling area. On the evidence it is established that they are the first port of call for vehicles that require mechanical services. And on Ms Carbin's evidence this morning they are the employees that arrange for vehicles to be repaired in terms of body work repairs by tier-two suppliers and vendors.
PN811
So they are the persons who do the negotiating, who obtain the quotes and so forth and the inspection of the vehicles when they return following repair. And I think from memory the evidence was that they also complete the paperwork in relation to those repairs and the paperwork in relation to the mechanical repairs, on the evidence of Ms Carbin, was also done by the supervisor of mechanical services. So that supervisor in mechanical services didn't only arrange for the repairs to be done but also was involved in the paperwork associated with it.
PN812
Now, can I move to the second limb which we say is applicable under 1(e) and that is preparation for sale. And the evidence establishes that QEK is intrinsically involved in the sale process for used cars and has a lesser involvement in relation to new cars. And that involvement, on the evidence this morning, clearly goes to, in effect, the pre-delivery of those cars for sale involving technicians and the mechanical technicians in the company vehicle fleet and the mechanical services supervisor who carry out the inspections, the servicing and the minor repairs where required.
PN813
Porters would be involved in this process, indeed, as with the detailers. And the fleet co-ordinators arrange for these cars to receive a roadworthy certificate. And the fleet co-ordinators vehicle administration complete the paperwork in respect of the repairs done by tier-two suppliers and they complete all sale documentation including the collection of money as well as updating the Holden bulletin board as to available cars. All of the relevant employees specified are engaged, in my submission, in the process or trade in connection with or incidental to the preparation for sale of motor vehicles.
PN814
So, Commissioner, in summary, can we just make the following points. A log of claims and letter of demand was served on QEK in respect of its Australian operations by the AMWU Vehicle Division. That log has been rejected by QEK. There is no issue of genuineness in relation to the log of claims that has been served. We say the log is properly authorised and the Commission can be satisfied of that on the materials provided by the union to the Commission. There is no evidence before this Commission to displace the presumption of regularity in terms of authorisation and on the evidence there is, in my submission, really, no issue that QEK employs persons who are eligible to be members of the AMWU pursuant to subrule 1E. And those persons include the classifications of employees that I have taken the Commission to.
PN815
Commissioner, the existence of an industrial dispute is a jurisdictional fact as the Commission as presently constituted would be well aware. And the facts relevant to the determination by the Commission of whether a dispute should be found to exist or not are the facts available at the time at which the determination was made. And that is clear from the cases cited at paragraph 19 of our outline and the facts at this time relate - in particular here I am making reference to the AMWU eligibility rule which has been broadened and is in the form consented to by Senior Deputy President Williams back in July with operation from 1 August and that is a fact before the Commission in relation to this dispute finding.
PN816
Can I also, in that regard, refer the Commission to a further decision. I don't have a copy of this one, Commissioner, but I will just give the Commission a reference. It is print M6162 and it is a decision of the Full Bench of the Commission. I previously gave my friend notice of - it involved the question of an enlargement of a dispute, Commissioner, once found. This is a decision of a Full Bench, Munro J, Deputy President Drake and Commissioner Nolan, October 1995. And the crucial question then was whether that dispute had been enlarged by deed of the eligibility rules of the CFMEU being enlarged. And I will just refer the Commission to page 23 and to the last paragraph on that page where it was said by the Full Bench, and this is at about point 3 of the last full paragraph:
PN817
In our view the question of membership coverage of builders' labourers generally by the CFMEU ...(reads)... We find that the subject matter of the relevant dispute were so expanded.
PN818
While this dealt with a dispute that had been found in my view the principle is equally applicable to the current situation where a log of claims and a letter of demand has been served and the Commission is asked to make a finding of dispute in relation to it, a principle coupled with that established that the facts relevant to the determination of the dispute finding are those at the time the dispute finding is made means that the Commission, in my submission, is making its decision as to the dispute finding on the basis of the expanded eligibility rule of the AMWU.
PN819
And in my submission the Commission should proceed to make a finding of dispute pursuant to section 101 in this matter. The parties to that dispute will be QEK and at a minimum the AMWU (Vehicle Division). And the subject matter of the dispute will be the terms and conditions contained in the log of claims served on 27 July this year. That concludes my submissions, Commissioner, unless the Commission has any further questions.
PN820
THE COMMISSIONER: No, that is fine. Thank you.
PN821
MR B. LAWRENCE: If the Commission pleases. There are some important matters of principle and some important legal issues in this case. One thing that one can be sure of is that if a dispute is found in the terms that have been advanced today there will be very significant ramifications. What we have here is a company that operates a vehicle fleet. A company that provides asset management to a particular client and in which, obviously at the outset, the asset cycle vehicles are obtained and at the end of the asset cycle vehicles are disposed of and in the course of the asset cycle, as one would expect with all mechanical products, vehicles in particular, there will be a need to attend to accidents, or the damage caused by accidents and the repair of the vehicle.
PN822
And this company is a dedicated company in that regard but the issues that are raised here could also apply in relation to any other company that operates its own fleet whether it be Coles-Myer or Linfox or for that matter Connex with its rail fleet. Any organisation that has some form of vehicular transport or that provides that as a dedicated service. If one looks at clause 1E which you were taken to earlier it extends to trains, it extends to aircraft and on my learned friend's view it would involve the repairing of aircraft, for example. And to use the sort of approach that he used today you would say, well, you look at people who are engaged in the repair of aircraft. I should imagine that is a logical consequence. In my submission it is a logical consequence of what he was putting.
PN823
And he goes further than that. He says not only can a dispute be created in relation to the people who were hands on in the repair of this work that is incidental to the running of a fleet business, but it is also sufficient - the rule is also sufficiently wide to enable those who supervise the people who were hands on who process the paperwork who authorise payments or arrange for a roadworthy certificate as an example. So there are very significant implications for this decision and in my submission it would enable, if a dispute was found here, it would enable this organisation to go into areas that it hasn't gone into before.
PN824
What we say is that the most important thing for the Commission to do in this case is to characterise the business that is under consideration here. It is a fleet management business in which there is as an incidental part the need to maintain vehicles either in-house or outside. My learned friend's view is that even if there wasn't a mechanic within the organisation, even if the repairs - all the repairs were done outside there would still be a sufficient connection with the rules and that a dispute could be created with that organisation because it has got to do with vehicles, it is in the vehicle industry, using the broadest sense of the term, and because they have repairs and there are people who look after repairs and he says they are working incidentally.
PN825
And so it really doesn't matter in terms of analysis, Commissioner, whether it is minor repairs or major repairs that are done in-house and it really doesn't matter whether any repairs are done in-house. Now, we say from our point of view the fact that minor repairs are done in-house and major repairs go outside is really an indicator of what the nature of this business is. It supports our view that properly characterised it is not in the industry of repairing motor vehicles, nor is it in connection with the repairing of motor vehicles. The tail doesn't wag the dog. And we say that 1E, clause 1E of the rules, is inappropriate and misconceived.
PN826
My learned friend hasn't quite formally conceded that rule 1A is available - sorry, is not available. But you will recall, Commissioner, from the last occasion we did have this debate and I pointed to - in fact my learned friend might have also pointed to the reference to motor mechanics under what is the general or traditional coverage of the AMWU. Now, of course, the fact of the matter is that if there was an award that covered motor mechanics, a common rule award operating in Victoria as there may be one day perhaps in the not too distant future, or as there used to be, then if these people are motor mechanics they will be covered by the award. They will be covered by an award that is based on the coverage of occupations.
PN827
And all that my learned friend did today was to demonstrate that in some cases if the principal purpose of the employment of these people is covered by a classification such as motor mechanic, then they will be covered by an award. So if there was an award of general operation that covered detailers, that covered porters, motor vehicles, or that covered motor mechanics, then the principal purpose would be established on the material, but that is not the case here.
PN828
My learned friend has gone into the administrative positions, the supervisory positions and he has given some emphasis to what Ms Carbin said in the course of her evidence about the connection that these people have with the repairing process, the paperwork, the recording and so on. And in my submission if there was an award of general application such as a clerical award, Clerical and Administrative Employees Award in Victoria, then these people would fall into it because they would be, if you look at her evidence as a whole, they would be principally engaged in administrative work.
PN829
Fleet co-ordinators are administrators. They do a variety of things and Ms Carbin set it out in - the variety of things in her statement. I won't go to the paragraph but she talked about all the sorts of issues that they would handle. And it is quite clear that work that they do in relation to repairs is minor and incidental. They are concerned with inquiries about leasing arrangements, about payments, about traffic infringements, etcetera. And so if there was an award of general application you would look to see what the principal purpose of these people's employment is and they would be covered. And so on it would go up the chain, it would go beyond the classifications that my learned friend has pointed to.
PN830
And if these people were employed in South Australia, if this operation was in South Australia we probably wouldn't be here because you would look at the common rule awards in South Australia and you would say, well, there is a motor mechanic classification. There is, and I suspect that this is the case, a detailer's or a porter's classification that was capable of being used and there is an administrative position. So if these people were in South Australia at the moment, then all of the people my learned friend is concerned about would be covered and they would be covered in the usual way that people are covered. You look at the principal purpose of their work and - of their engagement and you would answer the question in the context of these existing awards.
[12.15pm]
PN831
Now, what the AMWU want to do is to create award coverage where, for one reason or another, there isn't award coverage in Victoria and we know the history of that and we know from reading the newspapers that things are going to change and they want to create award coverage on what in my submission is an unsound basis. In my submission, they can't rely on the general power under subrule 1A for the reasons that I mentioned before, that this is a dispute created by the VBF division in respect of its affairs and its affairs are limited to the people who it is able to enrol under subrule 1E.
PN832
My learned friend on the last occasion referred to that clause that enabled people who were previously in another division, in the old AMWU if I could put it that way, to be transferred into the VBF division but that doesn't answer the questions, for the reasons I pointed out on the last occasion. So he is driven to rely on 1E. The VBF can only rely on 1E and then, in my submission, the problems start. Now, before I go further, Commissioner, could I just tender an extract from the rules of the AMWU.
PN833
MR B. LAWRENCE: I don't need to spend much time on this, Commissioner; my learned friend has gone through it, but could I just ask you to look at the front page briefly and you will see that it deals with the powers of the national conference of the organisation, and then turn to what is at the bottom right-hand corner of the page 108 of the 201 pages in these rules and you will see there, Commissioner, rule 50 subrule 4 deals with the transfer of members. I referred to that on the last occasion and I don't go to it again. If you turn to page 110 and second last paragraph on the page, number 7, refers to the Vehicle Division Conference having the management and control of the affairs of the division, para 7 on page 110.
PN834
Then over the page there is a reference to the - sorry, two pages on at page 112, this is the second last page of the document, small (e) in the middle of the page, "The Federal Executive may" exercise various powers, etcetera. My learned friend when he referred to the rules a little while ago referred to the powers of the federal secretary, which haven't been incorporated into this document. So in my submission, when you look at the demand that is made, it is a demand by this division in respect of the affairs of the division. There is nothing to indicate that there was any power added to the affairs of the division to enable a claim to be made outside subrule 1E.
PN835
So if there is to be a dispute here, it can only be under subrule 1E and, therefore, what might be called the obvious coverage that the union would have, that is to cover motor mechanics under subrule A, is gone; that is the capacity to identify a particular person whose principal purpose of employment is motor mechanic, so it is necessary to fall back on the characterisation of this clause and the business of QEK. Before I go to the clause could I say one other thing in relation to the dispute that has been created and this is the authorisation issue as we see it. It is a bit more than - in fact, critically more than what my learned friend puts.
PN836
They say that there was authorisation only given to the secretary to create a dispute in respect of the affairs of the division, therefore, limited to subrule 1E. We also pointed out on the last occasion, Commissioner, that it was clear that what was being proposed was a roping-in award. The dispute is a dispute about whether or not QEK be roped into a particular award and in my submission that can't be disregarded. There might be the standard log and there might be the standard letter of demand but if one looks at the claim that is being made, it is clear that it is for the purposes of roping-in.
PN837
Now, the very last page of AMWU3 is the minutes of the federal executive meeting of 12 June and it is said there - 7.35 is the item number - "Re roping-in award". Now, they are trying to rope - they are proposing to rope in various companies to an award that is not actually specified there. It just says "roping-in award". Incidentally, two other companies, my learned friend said on the previous occasion, had been the subject of a dispute finding. One is Dana and the other is Delphi.
PN838
Now, we don't know - there is no evidence about what they do and what they don't do but if they were, for example - those companies were in the business of repairing, if they were crash and repair companies, well, the sorts of issues we raise here are not raised there. So it is quite possible that a company could be roped into the award that they were intending the companies to be roped into but it doesn't extend - if they are crash repair companies, then it doesn't follow from that that we should be roped in.
PN839
Now, the other document that is relevant to this is QEK2, which is the AMWU notice. You remember, Commissioner, this is the notice that is given by the AMWU and indicates - and it is relevant because it is a jurisdictional fact - indicates what it is that separates the two parties and what it is that is claimed by the initiator of the dispute, the letter of demand. That is, they want coverage by the Vehicle Industry Repair Services and Retail Award 1983. So this is a dispute at its heart about whether or not this company can be roped into the Vehicle Industry Repair Services and Retail Award 1983 or, in its newer, simplified form it is the Vehicle Industry Repair Services and Retail Award 2002.
PN840
Now, I referred to this on a previous occasion, Commissioner. My submission is that another thing we can be sure of here is that this dispute couldn't lead to a roping-in to that award because that award doesn't cover the kind of situation that we have got here. I made some reference to it in passing. In order to demonstrate that, I tender an extract from the award.
EXHIBIT #QEK5 EXTRACT FROM VEHICLE INDUSTRY REPAIR SERVICES AND RETAIL AWARD
PN841
MR B. LAWRENCE: On the third page of this document - one shouldn't be confused by the pagination at the top, Commissioner, because it is actually two prints that have been joined together. The third page of this document deals with the incidence of the award and it reads:
PN842
This award shall apply in the states of...
PN843
Victoria, amongst others,
PN844
(i) to every operation carried on within or in connection with the establishment of an employer whose undertaking is principally concerned with the selling, distributing, repairing, maintaining, towing, wrecking, servicing, etcetera, of motor vehicles of all kinds...
PN845
And it goes on:
PN846
(ii) in other establishments principally concerned with the selling, distributing ...(reads)... of all kinds...
PN847
And it goes on:
PN848
to every operation concerned with the repair and servicing of motor vehicles in the establishment of an employer not falling within paragraphs (i) and (ii) hereof but who is engaged in the motor vehicle rental business.
PN849
And then it goes on:
PN850
Subject to the exemptions prescribed by this award, this award shall apply to all persons engaged on any operation in or in connection with or incidental to the retailing and/or ...(reads)... of tyres, or the like, made of any material.
PN851
So it clear, in my submission, that QEK could not be roped into this award. It does not apply to QEK because it is not principally concerned with the selling; it is not principally concerned with repairing; it is not a crash repair shop; it is not a used car dealership and it is not concerned with the motor rental business. So if there was to be an award made - if there could be a dispute created, then it can't be settled by reason of that and it would require - if there was jurisdiction, it would require a company specific award in which it would be necessary to go through each and every of the classifications and identify the principal purpose of the work.
PN852
Now, as I said before, if subrule A of the union's rules was available, then there could be a dispute created in respect of motor mechanics and in order to establish the basis for an award in respect of them you would look to see if these conditions - or the principal purpose of the employment of these technicians and if the answer was yes, then there could be an award made.
PN853
So could I now move on to subrule 1B. I want to, first of all, leave aside the words that were added by the decision of Senior Deputy President Williams and I will leave aside the introductory words when reading this provision. It reads:
PN854
The union shall consist of an unlimited number of employees engaged in or usually engaged in the process, trade or business connected with or incidental to the manufacture, assembly or repairing of...
PN855
and I will just pick out motor cars but as you would see, it covers everything, including planes. So what we say is this is an employer's industry. It identifies an employer's industry, an employer's activity. You look at a business that is concerned with the manufacturing of vehicles and, quite clearly, Holdens, Mitsubishi and so on are in this, and it is on that basis that this union has coverage. If there was a company, a smash repair company, it would be covered by this clause and it would be possible for a demand to be made on the crash repair shop and this crash repair shop could be, obviously, roped into the Vehicle Industry Repair Services and Retail Award 1983.
PN856
So what you look at, in my submission, is the employer's activity in these areas and there are words of extension, quite clearly. You look at activities that are connected with or incidental to those activities and the authorities that my learned friend has set out in his outline indicate that there have been a number of decisions over the years about what is in connection with or incidental to some activity. And here, in my submission, one looks at - one first of all has to find the activity of repairing, the employer's activity of repairing or manufacturing and then ask the question is this incidental to or this area that is under debate - the subject of debate, incidental to or connected with that area?
PN857
Now, a good example is, say, in relation to the provision of an in-house canteen, a canteen down at Fishermens Bend? That would be an activity that was a business of an employer, that is General Motors or perhaps somebody else, some other company. It would be, arguably in connection with or incidental to, and there have been cases, of course, to do with the construction of mines, for example, of uranium mines, whether the construction is part and parcel of the uranium mining. In the Poon Bros case there was a different approach in relation to the provision of a variety of services to a mining operation. In that case, there was a decision that was not in connection with or incidental to.
PN858
It is a question of degree but what one has to do in dealing with these matters is to identify the business that is really at the heart of the matter, identify the employer's business and say, well, is something else disputed area in or in connection with that business. Now, you first of all have to find, in this case, that the business properly characterised - properly characterised - of QEK was manufacturing, assembling, repairing, etcetera. Now, the one that is nominated is repairing. Now, in my submission, what is clear from the evidence is that QEK was not engaged in the repairing of vehicles in any meaningful way. It was an incidental part of its activities and it was not, as I indicated before, even necessary because all of it could have been contracted out, only the minor parts were in. It was quite incidental to it.
PN859
And what my learned friend is putting is that something which is incidental can be the means of getting a foot in the door. Now, my learned friend says you can be in more than one industry at a time. Well, that is quite true, but that really depends on a characterisation, and there will be companies engaged in some activities which activities when properly characterised could be said to be in that industry or some other industry. But the first thing you have to do here is to say, looking at the QEK operations, about which there is very extensive evidence, is it properly characterised in the motor vehicle repair industry? We say no.
PN860
We say quite clearly it is not and, therefore, no question arises as to whether or not its activities are incidental to or connected with that industry, because unless you are properly within that industry, it can't be said that your activities are connected with or incidental to the industry. We might put it colloquially as the tail cannot wag the dog. Now, you would have noticed, Commissioner, in the course of my learned friend's cross-examination of Ms Carbin that what he went for - and there is nothing wrong with this - was the repair aspect of the business and what he was, no doubt, trying to demonstrate was that there was a significant element of repair in the business.
PN861
Now, in my submission, you have to take Ms Carbin's evidence as a whole and to see just what it is that the business was engaged in and it was, in my submission, engaged in an industry, in a business, in an activity that cannot be properly characterised as vehicle repairing and, further, the amount of vehicle repairing that was done in that business was not so significant that it actually entered into the characterisation of the business. So there is a problem, in my submission, for the AMWU in relying upon what might be called the traditional part of clause 1E, the earlier form of clause 1E. It just doesn't apply to a business that is properly characterised as something other than vehicle repairing and which cannot be properly characterised as a business of vehicle repairing.
PN862
Now, my learned friend goes on to the second part of this rule, that is the additional words, and he says that, as I understand him, what you do is that you read the introductory words, which include the following:
PN863
...an unlimited number of employees engaged in or usually engaged in the process, trade or business connected with or incidental to...
PN864
Then he skips down to the words:
PN865
...preparation for sale of motor vehicles, pre-delivery and sale by auction...
PN866
etcetera. Now, there may be a debate about that. I would have thought that some of those words would not be incorporated but, rather, one would read the rule in relation to the later part as being this:
PN867
...an unlimited number of employees engaged in or usually engaged in preparation for sale of motor vehicles...
PN868
So you will see, Commissioner, there is a difference between the two. My learned friend wants to pick up the connected with or incidental to. Now, in my submission, if you do include the words "business connected with or incidental to", etcetera, then what is being indicated there is that it is concerned with the employer's industry, the employer's activity, and so these are the people who are engaged in the preparation for sale by companies of motor vehicles in regard to pre-delivery matters and the sale by auction of any motor vehicle, that is, auctioneers, including detailing work.
[12.40pm]
PN869
Now, that, in my submission, demonstrates again when you properly characterise it that this is not a company, QEK is not a company that is engaged in or connected with in any relevant way for the purposes of characterisation, the sale of motor vehicles and the sale by auction. QEK doesn't get the vehicles as a result of a sale, they are supplied by Holden. Holden remains the owner of the vehicles and the vehicles at the end are put on a Toll truck and they are taken off to the auction house. So if you are characterising the business for the purposes of seeing how this rule applies it is not a business in relation to sale of motor vehicles and it is not a business that is concerned with the sale by auction, it is engaged in the sale by auction of motor vehicles.
PN870
Now, the other way of reading that is to say, well, those words that have been added by the order of Senior Deputy President Williams are words that don't turn on the employer's activity but simply concentrate on the activity of the individuals, that is, they operate in the same way as the reference to motor mechanic in subrule 1A operates. Now, in relation to that, there is also another insuperable problem for the union. The test here is the principal purpose of the work and there is authority for that and I actually came out, Commissioner, without making copies of the two decisions that I was going to rely on but what I can do is give you the references and if you don't mind I will pass up a couple of copies that won't be too marked.
PN871
The first one, the most recent one, is a decision of Giudice J, Senior Deputy President Marsh and Commissioner Thatcher of 16 September 2003 and it is print PR938031. And the second one is a decision of a Full Bench, Senior Deputy President Williams, Senior Deputy President Lacy and Commissioner Tolley, of 17 December 2002. It is in print PR925731.
PN872
THE COMMISSIONER: I am sorry, just give me that again.
PN873
MR B. LAWRENCE: Yes. 925731.
PN874
THE COMMISSIONER: Thank you.
PN875
MR B. LAWRENCE: I will take the second one, that is the more recent one, first. Perhaps I should say that both of them are in relation to unfair dismissal claims and the question there was, in both of them, whether the applicant was covered by an award classification. And in the second one at paragraph 13 the Commission said:
PN876
We note that that the Commissioner adopted and applied a test based on the principal purpose ...(reads)... whether employees were engaged substantially in the duties of a relevant occupation.
PN877
Now, they went on to say in paragraph 14:
PN878
In this appeal both parties accepted that the principal purpose formulation as stated in Carpenter v Carona Manufacturing ...(reads)... In this case the result would be the same.
PN879
So the Full Bench didn't have to deal with the issue but nevertheless the principal purpose test was the one that was used there. In the case of Carpenter v Carona the Bench, at paragraph 9, said:
PN880
In our view, in determining whether or not a particular award applies to an identified employment ...(reads)... or otherwise promoting sales for articles...
PN881
etcetera. That was a sales manager kind of case, sales representative, sales manager. Now, in my submission what the Commission should do in this case is to proceed on the basis that the proper test is principal purpose. And so in relation to all of these people who have been identified, what is the principal purpose of their employment? But before coming to that can I come back to the rule as it was amended by Senior Deputy President Williams.
PN882
Assuming that it applies in that other sense as the employee's occupation rather than the employer's activity. The first part is preparation for sale of motor vehicles pre-delivery. Now, when the vehicles are received - when the vehicles are received they are not sold. When they are received by QEK they are not sold, they are not prepared for sale and these technicians aren't involved in the preparation for sale of motor vehicles in that sense. Then it goes on:
PN883
...and sale by auction of any motor vehicle including detailing work.
PN884
Well, of course, we do know that there is some work that is done prior to sending these vehicles off to Fowles, to the auction house. There has been some evidence about what work is done at that point but it is quite clear, in my submission, that whether you look at that end of the line process, that is, the asset disposition point, whether it be preparation for sale or sale by auction, the technicians, the detailers and the porters are not doing anything - it is not the principal purpose of their occupation. The principal purpose of their occupation has been to be involved in the maintenance of the vehicles over a long period of time.
PN885
And in fact it was said and I think my learned friend referred to this earlier, said 80 per cent of the time was on pre-delivery. Now, this is pre-delivery to the employees who have the car under a lease arrangement or for the person or driver if it remains a company vehicle, that is, it is not one of these "lease arrangements". So a minor part of the work of these people, detailers and technicians, is actually at the end of the process. They are engaged for something ongoing and much more substantial before that end process. And it is not even a tail that can wag the dog, it is barely a handful of hairs on the tail that we are talking about here.
PN886
Commissioner, in order to satisfy yourself that this rule has any operation you would have to find that a principal purpose, or the principal purpose of these people was the preparation for sale of motor vehicles and the sale by auction and the evidence just does not demonstrate that. And I note the reference to the 80 per cent of time being spent on pre-delivery. And that in that context meant pre-delivery to the employees.
PN887
And you will recall, Commissioner, and my learned friend made reference to this today, before the cars are taken by the Holden employees there is an amount of work that needs to be done. And while they have got it there is an amount of work that needs to be done. And then it is really only at the end of the process when there might be a need to improve the condition of the cars before they go off to auction or they are sold to employees that there is the kind of work that is referred to in that rule if that rule is to be limited in the way that I have indicated as a second reading of the rule.
PN888
So in my submission, Commissioner, there is no basis for finding that the rule, subrule 1E covers the employees of QEK, covers any of them. So I said before if 1A was available, and for reasons I gave before it is not available, then people who were substantially employed for the purpose of being a motor mechanic, or doing the work of motor mechanic, or any other group that is in 1A, would be caught but they are not caught here and this is not a case where the Commission should approach it on the basis of, well, if it had have been done in some other way there could have been coverage of the motor mechanics. Because this is a case where it wasn't done in that other way and the Commission has to determine the matter in accordance with the dispute that was created and the nature of the dispute that was created.
PN889
Now, could I come to the work that was relied upon by my learned friend. Now, the first category he referred to were the qualified motor mechanics and I don't think I need to add anything to what I said before. In regard to the supervisor, mechanical services, in my submission you should look to the description that Ms Carbin gave of his work in her statement and also the evidence that she gave today in relation to his work. He is a manager, he is a supervisor and he is, in my submission, quite clearly dealing with a range of matters that characterise his employment as being a manager.
PN890
The fact that he co-ordinates training, the fact that he has some oversighting of people in this area, in this repair area, or the technicians area, in my submission, does not give him a sufficient connection with any of the categories that would be available under subrule 1E. In particular, Commissioner, at paragraph 267, Ms Carbin said that he is not a qualified motor mechanic. So the work he carries out and the oversighting that he provides is not as a motor mechanic and, in my submission, when you look at his work you can't properly characterise his work as being incidental to the work of a motor mechanic.
PN891
If my learned friend's argument is correct in getting the supervisor or the manager of the motor mechanic into the rules, then again that would enable the union to cover administrative positions, supervisory positions that would enable a very substantial departure from their coverage. In my submission it is not there, the rules won't enable that. If you want to test it, just to have a bit of a test on what is available, in my submission, you ought to ask the question, well, if this person was in some - if there was an issue about whether this person was in - or covered by a Clerical and Administrative Employees Award, then you would find that this is the sort of supervision that a person covered by that award would provide.
PN892
Now, in relation to porters, my learned friend said, well, these people move the vehicles because they take them to and from repairs and he asked questions of Ms Carbin which indicated that. But she had indicated that they had a wider range of functions. They are involved in moving the cars as and when required and they are involved in moving the cars at the time of delivery, they are involved in moving the cars around from one show to another if there is some function, special event where there is a demonstration with these marketing fleets, they are involved in that.
PN893
They are involved in every aspect of the movement of cars. No doubt part of that will be the minor repairs but it would extend far and wide. And so if you ask the question, what is the principal purpose for which these people are engaged it is to move cars as and when required, not to work in the repair area. And, again, perhaps I should have mentioned this in relation to the supervisor, mechanical services. If you look at the principal purpose for which he is engaged it is in a management, supervisory position.
PN894
In my submission, the judgment in relation to the chemical plant and the gatekeepers is quite different because that was the chemical industry and so the question there was, are gatekeepers working in the chemical industry working incidentally to that industry. The answer was, yes. But you can't apply that to a porter who - sorry, I will go back a step. They were the gatekeepers, dedicated gatekeepers, whose substantive employment was gatekeeping in relation to the chemical works. But you can't apply that kind of reasoning to a porter who, from time to time, moves a vehicle from a repairer to a repairer.
PN895
Now, detailers, again, the same. The detailers - their substantial purpose is to wash and clean the cars and they will do it over a period of time, before the Holden employee takes the car and they will clean it up at the end before it goes and there are a variety of circumstances in which they will be involved in washing and cleaning the car. But their substantial purpose is to act as detailers. And in my submission that substantial purpose in QEK does not equal the coverage in the rule that I referred to a short time ago. The detailing there is limited to a particular area of activity. Here the detailing is in relation to another area of activity.
PN896
Now, vehicle co-ordinators. The vehicle co-ordinators, as Ms Carbin's statement indicates, have a wide range of functions. They are managers, they are supervisors, they are people who are involved in a whole range of activities. A very incidental part, in my submission, is concerned with repairs to vehicles, whether it is done in-house or out-of-house and, in my submission, you cannot say that the substantial purpose of the vehicle co-ordinator's employment was in regard to the repair of motor vehicles.
PN897
My learned friend broke up his classification by classification, or job by job analysis between the first and second limb of rule 1E. As you would have gathered, Commissioner, what I have done is to go through those positions and look at them as to whether they come under 1E or - sorry, the first limb of 1E or the second limb of 1E. In my submission, they don't come under either limb of rule 1E.
PN898
Now, in my submission, the kind of dispute that has been created here with the limitations that have been created intended, because there is an intention under the rules to rely on 1E, and the kind of dispute that has been created because of a desire to rope in QEK to the Vehicle Industry Award are fatal in this case. And, in my submission, the union is unable to create a dispute in respect of any category of employee, in respect of any category of employee at present. As I said before, if it was - you could say that this dispute properly relied upon, or could rely on some of the classifications in rule 1A, then the answer might be different but, in my submission, it doesn't. Because of the limitations that I have mentioned, it has to be found that there is no dispute.
PN899
Unless there is anything else, Commissioner, they are the matters that I wish to put to you in relation to that, although I should pass to you those two decisions that I referred to before.
PN900
THE COMMISSIONER: I didn't mark them before but I will now, Mr Lawrence.
EXHIBIT #QEK6 PRINT PR938031, DATED 16/09/03, DECISION OF GIUDICE J, SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT MARSH AND COMMISSIONER THATCHER
EXHIBIT #QEK7 PRINT PR925731, DATED 17/12/02, DECISION OF SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT WILLIAMS, SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT LACY AND COMMISSIONER TOLLEY
PN901
MR B. LAWRENCE: If the Commission pleases. There is just one other thing perhaps I should add, and I am conscious of the time. There is a question of whether or not there really is a dispute in relation to the South Australian employees. QEK2, which is the document that we tendered, the document from the AMWU indicates that the real dispute is in relation to the Victorian operations. And we think that it is - if you look at the dispute here, that it could not properly be said to be in any real sense a dispute involving South Australia.
PN902
THE COMMISSIONER: Did you want a break, Mr Lawrence, or are you ready to go on?
PN903
MR A. LAWRENCE: I am in the Commission's hands. I will probably be 15 minutes, perhaps 20 minutes.
PN904
THE COMMISSIONER: I am comfortable to go on if you are only going to be 20 minutes. We will finish by 1.30 at that rate. It might be best to have it behind us than to have a break and come back.
PN905
MR A. LAWRENCE: Yes. Commissioner, can I just deal with that final point last. The key document for the Commission in determining whether there is a dispute in this matter is the letter of demand and that letter of demand makes it clear that the demand is placed on QEK in respect of all its employees, whether in Victoria or South Australia. The letter of demand is the document that determines the scope of the dispute, not some other circular from the union post dates that.
PN906
Can I then deal with this issue of the question of the principal purpose, and I deal with that first and foremost. My learned friend seems in his submissions to have studiously avoided the definition of the word "repair" and that in my submission there is simply no question on the evidence that the principal purpose, if you just take, for example, the technicians in a company vehicle fleet and the technicians in a marketing fleet, the principal purpose of their employment is to undertake repairs of vehicles which incorporates the servicing function and the inspection function.
PN907
The evidence was crystal clear on this that Ms Carbin's evidence was, in terms of the inspection function, that is intrinsically related to the inspecting of the vehicle to determine if repairs need to be undertaken and, if so, what sort of repairs. So the repair function incorporates inspection, incorporates servicing and it incorporates repairs and there is no question on the evidence that the principal function of the work, if one applies that test in respect of the technicians, is that of repair. That is simply irrefutable on the evidence, in my submission.
PN908
The supervisor of mechanical services, my learned friend seems to indicate that this person cannot be covered because the union is not in a position to cover persons in supervisory positions. Can I just refer the Commission to the union's rules and, in particular, this goes to the general question of union coverage, AMWU coverage of persons in supervisory positions. It is rule 1C, and the Commission will see that there is a proviso at the end of rule 1C which says:
PN909
Provided that all foremen and supervisors of engineering production, foremen and supervisors of manufacturing processes, foremen and supervisors of construction work, foremen and supervisors of maintenance work and foremen and supervisors of repair work who are employed in any of the metal industry, aircraft industry or the vehicle industry in any of their branches and in all industries allied thereto shall remain eligible for membership of the union.
PN910
So there can be no issue persons in supervisory positions being generally eligible to be members of the union and there is no notion of a dividing line or a ceiling imposed in terms of union coverage of membership. In my submission, the proper characterisation of rule 1E is that of the employees' occupation rather than the employer's business or industry and can I refer the Commission to two decisions.
PN911
Firstly, just in relation to the issue of the principal function issue, it is the - these are decisions that are listed on our outline and they are at paragraph 6 of our outline of submissions. I am referring to the ANF v HSUA decision of Senior Deputy President Williams and the J. Fenwick and Co Pty Limited v Merchant Service Guild of Australia and Others, which is a decision of Ludeke J. The decision of Ludeke J, if I can just go to that quickly - and we make reference to the relevant pages in our outline, Commissioner, which are pages 101 and 102, where Ludeke J said this:
PN912
It was submitted that regard should be had only -
PN913
And this is at the bottom of page 101, and this relates to pilots in relation to tugs:
PN914
to the time actually spent on the tugs and launches in assessing whether these employees were seamen in the sense referred to in section 71(1) of the Conciliation and Arbitration Act and defined in section 6 of the Navigation Act ...(reads)... to ascertaining the principal purpose for which the worker is employed.
PN915
Then midway down page 102, Ludeke J says:
PN916
I am unable to accept this submission...
PN917
which went to the period of time actually spent on doing what was submittedly the principal purpose,
PN918
It may well be that an employee who spends 25 per cent of his time fulfilling the principal purposes for which he is employed qualifies by reason of that circumstance alone to be classified in the particular calling identified with that purpose.
PN919
That has also been considered in the decision of Senior Deputy President Williams in the ANF v HSUA case where at page 11 the Senior Deputy President said this at paragraph 39 on page 11:
PN920
In ascertaining the correct calling of an employee, it is appropriate to examine not only the nature of the duties performed by the employee but also where the employee carries out diverse duties the primary purpose for which the employee is employed.
PN921
Then at paragraph 40, the Senior Deputy President goes on and he makes reference there to the decision of Ludeke J:
PN922
Such a primary purpose may itself be discerned other than by reference to the expressed or specified purpose ...(reads)... to that in which the employee has been employed.
PN923
So the focus in determining the correct calling of the employee is to focus on the nature of the work undertaken and the circumstances in which the work was undertaken, in my submission. And if one confines oneself to looking at the issue of - if you look at the technicians and mechanical services supervisors, without question, the primary purpose of their work is that of repairing by dint of the definition of "repair", and we say the correct characterisation of the rule is to approach it from the point of view of the calling of the employee and what work is actually undertaken by the employee, as opposed to the nature of the employer's business.
PN924
But even if we are wrong about that, in my submission, the question that must be asked, even if it is accepted that it is an employer rule, the question that must still be asked and what the Commission must focus on is whether the employees in question here are engaged by this employer, QEK, in or in connection with or incidental to the process, the trade or business of repairing and, on the evidence, in my submission, that is simply irrefutable. They are so engaged and that is irrefutable, particularly in relation to the technicians.
PN925
The submission - not to do any injustice to my learned friend, but the submissions that have been put on behalf of the company almost amount to, well, we are somehow a unique business and, therefore, we should be left unregulated. Well, in my submission, what you have got to look at is the nature of the work that is undertaken by the employees in this business. The purpose is not to look at the nature of the business and say because this is some sort of asset management business, therefore its employees cannot be, either directly or incidentally, involved in the repairing of motor vehicles. That is simply the wrong test, in my submission.
PN926
The Commission must approach the matter from the point of view of looking at what the employees actually do, and the evidence, particularly in relation to the technicians is clear. What do they do? They are involved in repair. That is what they do directly and incidentally, without question.
PN927
My learned friend went to the issue of the question of the union seeking a roping-in and reference to that in the minutes of the Executive and to a subsequent AMWU notice. Can I just say in response to that, that really doesn't afford him any comfort in light of the decision in Riordan, where the decision certainly established the proposition, if it wasn't already established, that:
PN928
A log of claims may give rise to an industrial dispute notwithstanding that the motive in serving the log of claims was to create an industrial dispute which will attract the jurisdiction of the Commission to make an award.
PN929
That is clear in Riordan, the decision of the High Court at page 18, and in my submission, those issues are just simply not relevant to the finding of a dispute in this case. If one characterises the rule correctly and approaches it from the point of view of the work undertaken by the employees, Commissioner, the inescapable conclusion, in my submission, is that these employees are engaged in repairing - that is, particularly the technicians, for example; they are engaged in repairing or they are engaged in work that is incidental thereto, and that applies to the other classifications of employment that I identified in my earlier submissions. That concludes my submissions, Commissioner.
PN930
THE COMMISSIONER: Thank you. Are the parties happy to let this matter rest on all that is before me? Nothing further you want to add or correct? In that case, I will reserve my decision. I will advise the parties in due course. We will adjourn.
ADJOURNED INDEFINITELY [1.pmt]
INDEX
LIST OF WITNESSES, EXHIBITS AND MFIs |
BARBARA JADE CARBIN, ON FORMER OATH PN452
CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR A. LAWRENCE PN452
FURTHER EXAMINATION BY MR B. LAWRENCE PN649
WITNESS WITHDREW PN743
EXHIBIT #AMWU7 DECISION DATED 1971 RE CHEMICAL WORKERS PN799
EXHIBIT #QEK4 EXTRACT FROM AMWU RULES PN833
EXHIBIT #QEK5 EXTRACT FROM VEHICLE INDUSTRY REPAIR SERVICES AND RETAIL AWARD PN841
EXHIBIT #QEK6 PRINT PR938031, DATED 16/09/03, DECISION OF GIUDICE J, SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT MARSH AND COMMISSIONER THATCHER PN901
EXHIBIT #QEK7 PRINT PR925731, DATED 17/12/02, DECISION OF SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT WILLIAMS, SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT LACY AND COMMISSIONER
TOLLEY PN901
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