C2002/6254, Transcript of Proceedings [2003] AIRCTrans 818 (12 March 2003)

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TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS

AUSTRALIAN INDUSTRIAL

RELATIONS COMMISSION

SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT DUNCAN

C2002/6254

FINANCE SECTOR UNION OF AUSTRALIA

and

GIO AUSTRALIA LIMITED

Application under section 170LW of the Act
for settlement of dispute re retrenchment
calculations

SYDNEY

4.02 PM, FRIDAY, 21 FEBRUARY 2003

Continued from 31.1.03

Hearing Continuing

PN112

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Any variations to appearances?

PN113

MS HANNAN: No, your Honour.

PN114

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Well, Ms Hannan, please.

PN115

MS HANNAN: Thank you. Your Honour, I rely on the extensive submissions already sent to the Commission on this matter which I respectfully submit led to the Commission issuing directions on 31 January 2003 that: (1) FSU supply a list of affected persons that we wish payroll records to be supplied - that list was so supplied by email to Helen Davis on 31 January 2003; that Suncorp GIO was to supply those records by 14 February 2003 - those records have not been supplied and therefore the directions have not been complied with in any respect.

PN116

FSU submits that this matter has been dragging on far beyond what is reasonable. The starting point is to obtain those records and the FSU will be seeking that the Commission use whatever power is necessary to ensure compliance with the directions issued to date. We understand, your Honour, due to timetabling and difficulties today with the Commission needing to list another matter urgently on that basis for FSUs foreshadowed request that an order issue in the terms reflected that the directions issued to date will need to be heard at another time. Therefore FSU would therefore seek the earliest possible hearing date in order to have our application for an order heard. If it pleases the Commission.

PN117

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Mr Landy?

PN118

MR LANDY: Your Honour, we did endeavour to get those records for the FSU and I've just spoken to Deborah in the last five minutes about an email that was actually sent to her by Dennis Walsh outlining the difficulty we were having in obtaining those records and the difficulty is that they're sitting with AMP and they're on a server which is different to what they currently have so we've had to get an external IT contract in to extract that information. A fax was sent to Ms Hannan on 20 February but Ms Hannan said she didn't receive that, I've got a copy of that here, your Honour, which I've supplied Ms Hannan with as well.

PN119

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Am I to take it that there are no records other than the records that are in the AMPs system.

PN120

MR LANDY: There are some records that we would have received, your Honour, upon transfer, when we brought GIO but the data that we're actually looking for is captured in the previous AMP systems which we didn't receive a copy of those records upon transfer.

PN121

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Why is it not possible to supply the FSU with the material that you had in your own organisation.,

PN122

MR LANDY: Your Honour, from my understanding the information that FSU was seeking was not any of the information that we currently have supplied that we have available in our current system.

PN123

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: So everything is in the hands of the AMP.

PN124

MR LANDY: Yes, your Honour, at the moment, yes.

PN125

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: It is unsatisfactory but its certainly not your fault, Mr Landy, I've issued directions and I expect them to be complied with. I'm not saying you needn't seek orders, Ms Hannan, but I'm not quite sure that I'd distinguish between directions and orders quite frankly, one requires compliance as much as the other. What I'll do is I will list it for a week today on the basis, Mr Landy, that GIO Australia will do everything it possibly can to extract from the entrails of the AMP the documents that quite reasonably have been sought under the directions.

PN126

MR LANDY: Yes, your Honour. We do have an IT contractor working on that earlier next week so we hope to be able to do that.

PN127

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Well, I certainly hope so too. I acknowledge the fact that its difficult but time is getting away from us and I think something needs to be done rather special. I don't think there's anything more we can do except to fix a time and date for next week.

PN128

MS HANNAN: As your Honour pleases, I would just note perhaps that Mr Landy could confirm formally to FSU that the information that was supplied to Suncorp in terms of the records available for GIO employees when they brought GIO Australia Limited comprises only that employees classification level, rate of pay and superannuation contribution. So I would be appreciative if Mr Landy in the interim could confirm what details were actually transferred at that point of time and the breadth of information that they have. If it pleases the Commission.

PN129

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Do you understand that, Mr Landy.

PN130

MR LANDY: Yes, your Honour. I don't mind talking to you after this and just get the specifics of what you want so.

PN131

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: I think that would be wise. I'll adjourn the proceedings until 2pm on Friday, 28 February next. I adjourn this matter accordingly.

ADJOURNED UNTIL FRIDAY, 28 FEBRUARY 2003 [4.09pm]