AG2003/9691, Transcript of Proceedings [2004] AIRCTrans 106 (8 January 2004)

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TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS


O/N F5737

AUSTRALIAN INDUSTRIAL

RELATIONS COMMISSION

COMMISSIONER SIMMONDS

AG2003/9691

APPLICATION FOR CERTIFICATION OF
AGREEMENT

Application under section 170LJ of the Act
by Casey City Council and Others for certification
of the Casey City Council Enterprise Bargaining
Agreement 2003

MELBOURNE

10.25 AM, TUESDAY, 16 DECEMBER 2003

PN1

MR S. WILSON: From VECCI. I appear for the City of Casey. With me I have MS S. SIEMENSNA from the City.

PN2

MS L. SUMPTER: I appear on behalf of the Australian Services Union.

PN3

MR J. SLINGSBY: I appear for the Australian Education Union.

PN4

MS B. ILIAS: I appear on behalf of the LHMU.

PN5

MR B. MEGENNIS: I appear on behalf of the Australian Nursing Federation.

PN6

THE COMMISSIONER: Thank you, Mr Megennis. Yes, Mr Wilson?

PN7

MR WILSON: Thank you, Commissioner - - -

PN8

MS SUMPTER: Sorry, excuse me, if the Commission pleases, also appearing on behalf of APESMA.

PN9

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes, thank you.

PN10

MR WILSON: Thank you, Commissioner. Commissioner, this is an application for certification of the enterprise agreement to cover the staff of the City of Casey and to that end we would rely on the statutory declaration of Michael Tyler who is the chief executive officer of the City. But in doing so I should refer you, Commissioner, to clause in the statutory declaration, 7.4, where there is one issue that has been identified as a reduction and that is at clause 31 in the agreement, the hours of work which provides for time worked in excess of normal hours to be taken as time in lieu on an hour for hour basis.

PN11

However, time worked in excess of 10 hours in any one day will be paid as overtime in accordance with the award. So thee is the issue of the working up to 10 hours. Commissioner, if I can just give you an example, and I might say that this particular issue appears in a number of the - in the appendices that are part of the agreement and even though I am only using one example I do have examples for all of those if it would be of assistance, Commissioner.

PN12

But the relativities, if I can put it that way, are pretty much the same. So if I can give you an example of an employee who is band 6C and if we assume the employee works 10 hours on one day of every month and the employee's normal hours of work are eight, so on one day a month he is working, or she is working two hours extra. The employee would typically work a 19 day four week cycle which is why it would be an eight hour day. From an award perspective, Commissioner, the weekly award wage for that person would be $847.80.

PN13

The time and a half which gives an hourly rate, sorry, of $22.30-odd cents, which gives a time and half rate of $33.47. So he or she, that employee, would be entitled to two hours between the eight and 10 hours of time and a half and if we take it on a monthly basis, Commissioner, for that full month - for that four weeks, sorry, the person would get their normal pay, $3391.20, eight hours at time and a half would be $267.73 for a total in that month of $3658.93.

PN14

Under the enterprise bargaining - or the enterprise agreement, Commissioner, the weekly rate - wage rate as at March 2004 would be on a weekly basis, $1030.69 which is an hourly rate of $27.12. So, again, in that same example for four weeks on a monthly basis that individual would get a payment of $4122.76, eight hours pay instead of - at time and a half - just normal pay of $216.99 giving them a monthly salary of $4339.75 which is about $800-odd per month in excess of what they would get under the award typically working those couple of extra hours, Commissioner.

PN15

THE COMMISSIONER: But, it is open to the employer to require them to work 10 hours every day for those 19 days, is it not?

PN16

MR WILSON: Well, theoretically, that is possible, Commissioner, yes.

PN17

THE COMMISSIONER: Well - - -

PN18

MR WILSON: But again - - -

PN19

THE COMMISSIONER: No, if this agreement is certified it is open to the employer to require them to work those hours, is it not?

PN20

MR WILSON: Yes, yes, but we would - - -

PN21

THE COMMISSIONER: And how does the calculation go then?

PN22

MR WILSON: Well, I haven't got the calculation for that worst case scenario, Commissioner, but we would be prepared to give an undertaking that it wouldn't go to anywhere near that. I mean, the typical incidences, is as I have indicated in the example. Commissioner, we would be prepared to give the commitment that, as I have said, it rarely happens in any event, but there is also a commitment within the enterprise agreement or an undertaking to keep overtime to minimum.

PN23

But in terms of the actual arithmetic of the - for the submission, Commissioner, we would be prepared to give an undertaking that it wouldn't happen more than twice a month.

PN24

THE COMMISSIONER: What is the situation with the drainage and cleansing work group? They don't seem to have a spread of hours.

PN25

MR WILSON: Commissioner, their spread of hours would be between six and six - or is between 6 am and 6 pm.

PN26

THE COMMISSIONER: Monday to Friday?

PN27

MR WILSON: Monday to Friday, sorry, yes,.

PN28

THE COMMISSIONER: Well, that is the point I am raising because you can see - - -

PN29

MR WILSON: Yes, I can see - the wording of it certainly is not clear on that.

PN30

THE COMMISSIONER: Well, the point is that all the others do have Monday to Friday.

PN31

MR WILSON: Yes, it is Monday - six to six, Monday to Friday, Commissioner.

PN32

MS SUMPTER: Excuse me, if the Commission pleases, it is actually this bit under clause 31.2.2 which - it talks about the spread.

PN33

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes, I can see that. Yes, it seems to be picked up there. So, what is the undertaking you are giving?

PN34

MR WILSON: With respect to the spread of hours?

PN35

THE COMMISSIONER: No, there clearly is a spread of hours - - -

PN36

MR WILSON: Yes, yes.

PN37

THE COMMISSIONER: - - - at 31.2.2.

PN38

MR WILSON: Commissioner, in terms of the eight to 10 - in excess of eight hours but up to 10, our undertaking is that that would not happen more than twice a month, Commissioner.

PN39

THE COMMISSIONER: So that would still leave them well within that $800?

PN40

MR WILSON: The example I have given, admittedly, is only once a month - two hours a month. I am saying four hours a month, so - - -

PN41

THE COMMISSIONER: Right.

PN42

MR WILSON: - - - it is still well within the realms.

PN43

THE COMMISSIONER: Still more than that - - -

PN44

MR WILSON: Yes.

PN45

THE COMMISSIONER: - - - situation, yes, understand. Yes, thank you, thanks, Mr Wilson. Ms Sumpter?

PN46

MS SUMPTER: Yes, thank you, Commissioner, we support the application and rely on the statutory declarations signed by Mr Russell Attwood and seek that the Commission certify this agreement today.

PN47

THE COMMISSIONER: And you also rely on the - - -

PN48

MS SUMPTER: And also the stat dec filed by - - -

PN49

THE COMMISSIONER: Signed by Mr Artis.

PN50

MS SUMPTER: - - - Mr Artis from APESMA.

PN51

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes, thank you. Who is next? Yes, Mr Slingsby?

PN52

MR SLINGSBY: If the Commission pleases, the Australian Education Union supports the application and we rely on the statutory declaration signed by Ms Rosalie Kingston who is the vice president of the AEU and we seek to have the document certified as of today.

PN53

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes, thank you. Ms Ilias?

PN54

MS ILIAS: If it pleases the Commission, yes, I would rely upon the statutory declarations filed by Mr Brian Daley the branch secretary of the LHMU in support of the application for certification of this agreement this morning and also to support the submissions that are made on behalf of Casey Council in relation to the certification today. If it pleases the Commission.

PN55

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes, thanks, Ms Ilias. And finally, Mr Megennis?

PN56

MR MEGENNIS: Thank you, Commissioner, the ANF relies upon the statutory declarations provided by the acting secretary, Ms Deanne Randwick in support of the application. The ANF also supports the comments as outlined by my colleagues here this morning. I might request if it is possible, given the comments raised by Mr Wilson, that the ANF request a transcript in relation to the matter. If the Commission pleases.

PN57

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes, thank you. In respect to that matter raised by Mr Megennis, yes, it is my intention to order transcript in respect of this matter because there has been an undertaking given. This matter is an application for the certification of an agreement known as the Casey City Council Enterprise Bargaining Agreement 2003. On the basis of the statutory declarations which have been submitted by each of the parties to the agreement - I should say by officers of each of the parties to the agreement.

PN58

On the basis of the submissions that have been made this morning and on the basis of - and taking account of the undertaking that has been given on behalf of the Council by Mr Wilson I am satisfied that the agreement meets the test prescribed in the legislation. Accordingly I have certified the agreement with effect from today's date and it will remain in force until 15 December 2006. And if there is nothing further the proceedings inn this matter are adjourned. Thank you.

ADJOURNED INDEFINITELY [10.35am]