C2004/6125, Transcript of Proceedings [2004] AIRCTrans 3979 (15 October 2004)

AUSCRIPT AUSTRALASIA PTY LTD
ABN 72 110 028 825

Level 4, 179 Queen St MELBOURNE Vic 3000
(GPO Box 1114 MELBOURNE Vic 3001)
Tel:[phone] Fax:[phone]

TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS


O/N 8638

AUSTRALIAN INDUSTRIAL

RELATIONS COMMISSION

COMMISSIONER BLAIR

C2004/6125
C2004/6126

HILLS AND MASON PTY LTD

and

CONSTRUCTION, FORESTRY, MINING
AND ENERGY UNION

Notification pursuant to section 99 of the Act
of a dispute re alleged refusal to provide
access to the Bovis Lend Lease Melbourne
Central site to people who have not signed
up to the FFTS SEET Scheme

APPLICATION FOR AN ORDER TO STOP
OR PREVENT INDUSTRIAL ACTION

Application under section 127(2) of the Act
by Hills and Mason Pty Ltd for an order to
stop or prevent industrial action

MELBOURNE

11.36 AM, TUESDAY, 5 OCTOBER 2004

PN1

MR D. BLANKSBY: I appear on behalf of the Glass and Glazing Association of Victoria and I have with me MR H. HILLS, the Managing Director of Hills and Mason.

PN2

MR D. EVANS: I appear on behalf of the CFMEU Furnishing Division.

PN3

THE COMMISSIONER: Mr Blanksby.

PN4

MR BLANKSBY: Thank you, Commissioner. Hills and Mason having been working on the Bovis Lend Lease site at Melbourne Central for over 12 months now, and this is, in fact, about their 25th job - they are glazing there as they are doing all the shopfronts. On 1 October they were stopped from going on site by the construction division shop steward, Steve Barro, who said that you can't come on site because he had been advised by the FFTS to kick them off. We rang Ernie Landers, who is the FFT organiser for the site work regarding the issue and he told me to ring Joe Patti, who is one of the other organisers, as it was his issue with Hills and Mason in charge of this case. I might add that Joe is off sick at the moment and we are not sure when he will be back.

PN5

I didn't realise he was ill at that time - I rang Joe and left a message on his mobile. This was on the 1st of the 10th. I rang the FFTS office and left a message for Joe to ring me at work or on the mobile with Leisha, one of the office girls, and also asked to speak to Leo Skourdoumbis, the secretary. He was not available. I rang Rodney Hills at Hills and Mason, who is the General Manager, I guess. Joe Patti had not spoken with Hills and Mason regarding this matter. He had visited some time ago with the forms to join SEET and Howard Hills advised that they had issues with the scheme and were not interested at this time. Rodney asked the Glass Association to handle this issue on their behalf.

PN6

Later on that day I rang the FFTS to find out who was handling the cases that - since the unfortunate departure of Dick Lowe and I was referred to Doreen, one of the - I think is the office manager. I discussed this with Doreen and she was uncertain who would be doing the advocacy but she would get Joe Patti rang. I rang four more times on that day to speak to either he or Leo and Leo's mobile was diverted to the office each time, and then I sent a fax to Leo Skourdoumbis and Joe Patti asking them to contact me at 1530 on the 1st, which was Friday. I didn't get any response to that. On 4 October Hills and Mason did not send any workers to the site because they were still expecting trouble. They went to the - the glazing manager went to site and submitted up to date copies of CBUS, Incolink and WorkCover documentation.

PN7

On the Friday I had rung Steve Broadhead, who is the industrial officer for Bovis Lend Lease, and told him that if his staff member, who was the site shop steward and organiser, was going to keep applying what I would term as a secondary boycott we would bring him into this. He asked for a copy of the EBA which I e-mailed him. He spoke to the people on - his people on site and rang me back and said that they would not be stopping us; it was up to the FFTS to have their organiser stop us working on site. Yesterday Hills and Mason went to the site, handed in all the stuff and were told that at this stage they didn't see any problems. They would be able to get on site - this is by the construction division organiser - and they would have to resolve any issues they had with the FFTS.

PN8

He rang Joe Patti's mobile and got no reply - this is Howard Figell, I think it is, the glazing manager - there are two Howards involved here - FFTS. He left messages there and didn't - and no one got back to him. Leo skourdoumbis, apparently he got back to him later in the day and said, well, we need to have a chat about this and that was all that was arranged. This morning at 7.30 I got a call from Hills and Mason advising the staff had been stopped on site by Ernie Landers, one of the organisers from the FFTS, and the Bovis Lend Lease said he needed to have a copy of the EBA which his boss had had and they had had one submitted, the job safety audit which had been submitted when they were first doing the work and that a meeting was to be held between Joe Patti and Hills and Mason as it was not their problem.

PN9

I note that some 25 shopfronts had been glazed on this site with the existing job safety audit that was lodged in the first instance and the EBA had been sighted. The glass had been unloaded and stacked at the workplace and they ordered that that be carted out from the - it is a shopping centre type complex, and put back onto the truck, and at 7.45 I think in response to our lodging this application they rang Hills and Mason and said it was okay to commence work on the site and they would endeavour to get the glass back onto the site before they close off, which is I think about 8 o'clock - they are not allowed to cart the glass onto site. So at this stage I believe that Hills and Mason are working on the site. Howard Finkell, the glazing foreman, was told they were okay for the two jobs that are there but they won't be for any others. This was this morning about 8 o'clock we were told that.

PN10

The impact that this has on the company is significant in that they have three or four times sent people to be site glazing crews and they haven't been able to do the work. They have left the site and have been reallocated to other tasks that the company has, but it is at this stage affecting the company so much that at this stage they had two - they were asked to tender for two more jobs on the site and they have told the people they do the work for that because of this hassle they don't believe they can do the job unless it gets resolved. So it is certainly impacting on the company. Commissioner, that is a bit of background to it. We are finding it very difficult to communicate with the FFTS on these matters.

PN11

You will remember that when we - before you with Dick Lowe and myself and Howard Hills, we discussed and talked our way through the EBA, AG2003/10467, which was resolved in the Commission here before you and that EBA was signed. Part of that resolution was that Hills and Mason would not be involved in the SEET Scheme on this round of EBAs, they would be examining it for the next one. As I understand it, we are being stopped because they have not yet signed a SEET as security of the employee entitlement scheme that the FFTS have put together and we believe that this breaches, number 1, the dispute procedures of the award; number 2, the dispute procedures of the EBA and the Workplace Relations Act and it is once again just a bit of a wild card effort, we believe, in that they just stop people on site and try and create pain for the employer.

PN12

In relation to that, Commissioner, we would seek that we be granted today, after some discussion, a section 127 order to prevent or stop industrial action by the CFMEU against Hills and Mason. If the Commission pleases.

PN13

THE COMMISSIONER: Have you a draft 127?

PN14

MR BLANKSBY: I have got - yes, I do have a draft here that I sent in as a fax and I do have it on disk here.

PN15

THE COMMISSIONER: Okay. If I have could have a look at that draft, please. Have you shown Mr Evans that draft?

PN16

MR BLANKSBY: It was the one that was faxed as a part of the facts. There is an application for them to stop or prevent industrial action.

PN17

THE COMMISSIONER: Right. Yes. Thank you. Yes, Mr Evans.

PN18

MR EVANS: Mr Commissioner, I must admit that I only become aware of this matter approximately an hour ago. There hasn't been any deliberate stonewalling, whatever. As I understand it, Joe Patti is sick. Leo Skourdoumbis up till about 45 minutes ago was uncontactable; I have spoken to him since. The union is ready to resolve the matter. Leo apparently - Leo Skourdoumbis apparently received a telephone call last night asking for, I think it was maybe Rod Hills, to have talks on the matter. Leo is waiting for that phone call and is quite happy at any time to sit down and try and work out exactly what the problem is.

PN19

So unfortunately there is a bit of turmoil in the office at the moment with the passing of Dick Lowe at the moment, and we all are trying to cover our tracks as best as we can, but the union is quite prepared to sit down with the company and see if we can work something out; see if we can do it in a civilised manner and everybody can go on their way again. Thanks.

PN20

THE COMMISSIONER: Well, I am not sure what the issue is because the Commission did, as currently constituted, participate in the enterprise negotiations and there was an agreement reached and an agreement has been certified. If the issue is SEET then it is already covered by the enterprise agreement in that that is not an issue during the life of this agreement. If there are other issues that the union has some concerns about, then the point that Mr Blanksby makes is that they are not following the disputes procedure, in that they are to raise them with the company without any form of industrial action or any bans.

PN21

So what I would propose to do at this stage is have Mr Blanksby - and I understand through personal experience that there is some - or there might be some difficulty in phone contact being made by Mr Blanksby with some officers of the union; however, if Mr Blanksby is the authorised representative of Hills and Mason, then he is entitled to contact the appropriate officer of the union and seek a meeting as a matter of some urgency. If I am advised that there is further action against Hills and Mason, without the disputes procedure being followed, I will not reconvene but I will issue the 127 orders in the terms sought by the company.

PN22

I am a very strong believer in the grievance procedure being followed and if that means coming here to debate the issues in conference, I am happy to do that, but it is to be done without any industrial action being in place whatsoever. Now, Mr Blanksby, you understand that?

PN23

MR BLANKSBY: Yes, Commissioner.

PN24

THE COMMISSIONER: Mr Evans.

PN25

MR EVANS: Yes.

PN26

THE COMMISSIONER: And if those words could be conveyed to your appropriate people - Mr Hill is here - and to your secretary and president.

PN27

MR EVANS: Absolutely.

PN28

THE COMMISSIONER: Thank you.

PN29

MR EVANS: Thank you.

PN30

THE COMMISSIONER: The Commission will stand adjourned.

ADJOURNED INDEFINITELY [11.49am]