AG2006/4506, Transcript of Proceedings [2006] AIRCTrans 834 (22 June 2006)

TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS

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Workplace Relations Act 1996 15205-2

SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT ACTON

AG2006/4506

F.I.P PTY LTD
AND
NATIONAL UNION OF WORKERS-NEW SOUTH WALES BRANCH AUTOMOTIVE, FOOD, METALS, ENGINEERING, PRINTING AND KINDRED INDUSTRIES UNION
s.170MH pre-reform Act - Application to terminate agreement (public interest)
(AG2006/4506)

MELBOURNE

1.05PM, FRIDAY, 09 JUNE 2006

THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE CONDUCTED VIA VIDEO CONFERENCE AND RECORDED IN MELBOURNE

PN1

MR M MEAD: I appear for the Australian Industry Group on behalf of F.I.P Pty Limited. Your Honour, appearing with me today is MR C KATAKOUZINOS who is managing director for the company.

PN2

MR A JOSEPH: I seek leave to appear on behalf of the NUW and I have with me MR S CAIN.

PN3

MR I MORRISON: I appear on behalf of the Australian Manufacturing Workers Union. With me today is MR M HOBAN, the organiser for the site.

PN4

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Mr Mead, this matter has been listed because you thought directions should be issued.

PN5

MR MEAD: Yes your Honour. We have notified the Commission of our intention to seek to have the F.I.P Pty Limited Enterprise Agreement 2003 terminated which is a Preserved State Agreement under the terms of the Workplace Relations Act 1996. We have sought this matter to be listed as your Honour has outlined for the purpose of directions to be issued for the filing and serving not only submissions but also any evidentiary requirement that may be necessary in support of this application.

PN6

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes.

PN7

MR MEAD: I had discussed very briefly with my friends at the bar table a projected time line. We have advised the union that we were seeking to have a hearing date commencing sometime in the week of 3 July. The reason for that being that Mr Katakouzinos is regrettably out of the country from 12 July through to the 22nd and from the company's point of view there is some urgency in having this matter heard and determined as soon as reasonably practicable. My friends at the bar table advise me that they don't believe that that time line is one that they will be able to align themselves with in terms of providing material.

PN8

So on that basis I imagine what we will be seeking is to try and establish a hearing date for the hearing of this application and then try and work backwards in terms of dates for the filing of any materials and evidence.

PN9

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Well this matter has actually been allocated to Senior Deputy President Marsh. I'm at this stage only dealing with it because Senior Deputy President Marsh is on leave until the middle of next week. So I've listed it at your urgent request. I'm not sure that I can commit SDP Marsh to a hearing date.

PN10

MR MEAD: I understand that, your Honour. If I just might take a moment?

PN11

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes.

PN12

MR MEAD: Your Honour, if perhaps my colleagues from the union might be able to give an idea of how much time they might need to put on their materials, we can then obviously provide the Commission with dates that we believe we can put our materials on and then we'll have a hearing date established subsequent to that.

PN13

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Well usually you'd tell me first how long it's going to take you to get your materials together.

PN14

MR MEAD: Yes your Honour. I have foreshadowed with my colleagues at the bar table a period of not more than 10 days. We could, imagine get our materials on by the 19th however I believe that the union does not believe they can get their materials on by the 29th which was the time that I had envisaged for them in terms of reciprocal preparation time.

PN15

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Okay so you've got by 19 June and what sort of materials would they be?

PN16

MR MEAD: We imagine that we'll file an outline of submissions and also two or possibly three witness statements in terms of evidence.

PN17

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Okay. Thank you. Mr Joseph?

PN18

MR JOSEPH: Yes thank you, your Honour. Your Honour, ultimately it's a matter for the Commission but might I respectfully suggest that it would be appropriate given that Senior Deputy President Marsh would be having carriage of the matter as I understand from what your Honour has said, that it would be appropriate for the matter to be mentioned before Senior Deputy President Marsh for the purpose of directions as well as the setting of a hearing date.

PN19

In saying that, your Honour, that doesn't – if that were to occur say for example in a week or so's time, that doesn't stop the company from beginning to prepare its material anyway and then it could go before her Honour at some stage in the next week to 10 days and let the unions know when their material can be provided and then we can deal with that matter before her Honour as to a timetable for replying to the company's material and the setting of a hearing date of course.

PN20

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Mr Morrison?

PN21

MR MORRISON: Yes your Honour. What Mr Joseph says makes eminent sense to us. It seems quite practical bearing in mind that from what I understand you will not be now hearing this matter.

PN22

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Well let me correct you on that. Senior Deputy President Marsh is the panel head. She allocates the files. In her absence I'd allocated it to her because it was a New South Wales matter. She may come back and decide you've started it, Senior Deputy President Acton, you can finish it but that's a decision for her. So that's the state of play at the moment.

PN23

MR MORRISON: Well I think we can, we would be dealing then with the potential about whether we make a timetable with your – to as has been suggested by Mr Mead or what I think Mr Joseph's saying makes the more sense that there's nothing to stop Mr Mead preparing his documentation but Senior Deputy President Marsh, if she does take ultimate carriage of the matter, her timetable will not be, will not impact on Mr Mead's preparation. He can proceed on the assumption that at some stage she'll allocate some dates and Mr Mead's halfway there. So we won't be starting afresh when we do have that hearing that's envisaged in front of the Senior Deputy President.

PN24

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes. Thank you, Mr Morrison. Mr Joseph, have you given any thought to how many witnesses et cetera you might have?

PN25

MR JOSEPH: It's a little difficult to do that until we see the company's material. I would have thought – and obviously – I would say probably two, your Honour.

PN26

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes.

PN27

MR JOSEPH: But obviously one – given that the union's a part of a bargaining unit as I understand it may be that there's some ability to avoid duplication.

PN28

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Right.

PN29

MR JOSEPH: In respect of some aspects of the application but it's difficult to commit to anything with any great certainty your Honour, simply because we don't know the company's case yet.

PN30

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes. Okay. What about this suggestion that I issue directions for the company to file an outline and witness statements by the 19th and I discuss the matter with SDP Marsh. If she intends to retain the matter, whether she might list it towards the end of next week as to what should happen to the unions.

PN31

MR MEAD: We would have no objection to that, your Honour.

PN32

MR JOSEPH: No objection from the NUW your Honour.

PN33

MR MORRISON: No objection from us either, your Honour.

PN34

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Very well. Well I'll issue the directions formally but they will be of this nature. That the company is to file in the Commission and serve on the NUW and the AMWU an outline of its submissions and any witness statements and other evidence on which it intends to rely by close of business on 19 June 2006. Is there anything else?

PN35

MR MEAD: No your Honour.

PN36

MR JOSEPH: No thank you, your Honour.

PN37

MR MORRISON: No thank you.

PN38

THE SENIOR DEPUTY PRESIDENT: I'll now adjourn.

<ADJOURNED INDEFINITELY [1.14PM]