C2006/3949, Transcript of Proceedings [2007] AIRCTrans 49 (12 February 2007)

TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS

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Workplace Relations Act 1996 16431-1

COMMISSIONER SMITH

C2006/3949

FINANCE SECTOR UNION OF AUSTRALIA
AND
NATIONAL AUSTRALIA BANK LIMITED
s.170LW -prereform Act - Appl’n for settlement of dispute (certified agreement)
(C2006/3949)

MELBOURNE

10.22AM, TUESDAY, 30 JANUARY 2007

Continued from 14/12/2006

THE FOLLOWING PROCEEDINGS WERE CONDUCTED VIA VIDEO CONFERENCE AND RECORDED IN MELBOURNE

PN71

THE COMMISSIONER: Who wishes to report? Yes, Mr O’Brien?

PN72

MR O'BRIEN: I think I have been allocated the task, Commissioner, in emergencies.

PN73

THE COMMISSIONER: Congratulations.

PN74

MR O'BRIEN: Commissioner, since we were last here a lot of activity has occurred and I’m pleased to report back that I think a number - there have been a number of positive outcomes that have been planned at this stage and will continue to occur over the next month.

PN75

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes.

PN76

MR O'BRIEN: Shortly after our previous hearing, we received a letter - we have now received a letter from the FSU dated 20 December which outlined a number of the FSU concerns and a table of matters that the FSU requests to look at in terms of our proposed matrix. They have been the subject of some discussions. I’m quite happy to provide you with a copy of this letter if you believe it would - - -

PN77

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes, I’d be pleased. Are you happy with that?

PN78

MR P LARAGY: Yes, sure. Definitely.

PN79

MR O'BRIEN: Just turning to the matrix that we had previously advised the Commission that we would develop, we did develop a draft which was set out in table form which went through the particular items and then compared both key aspects of the workers comp and health and safety schemes in each of the states as against the proposed ComCare system. As I say, we did that on key items. The purpose of that was just to highlight just key issues and just give a brief description or summary and then just how - what the differences were with ComCare.

PN80

What we did is that after we prepared a draft of that matrix, we did provide a copy to the FSU. We had a subsequent meeting with the FSU and then they came back to us with a number of issues that they believed should be included, a number of amendments to the draft. We had a subsequent meeting. We have since redefined - re-refined our matrix table and we’re at the point where what we will do is - after we have had discussions with the FSU with respect to a whole range of issues that they have raised arising out of that meeting, that we will refine it again and provide them with a copy. That will provide the basis of the discussions and consultations that we’ll have with staff, one of the key areas.

PN81

This morning I received a note from Mr Laragy, an email, that raised a whole series of issues, about ten points, that they wish to raise with us about the matrix out of our discussions. I think it’s something that both Ms Hannan and Mr Laragy wish to discuss this morning before the Commission.

PN82

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes.

PN83

MR O'BRIEN: We are making progress, as I say, on the matrix. We have consulted heavily with the FSU. We would hope to finalise that very, very shortly and be able to, as I say, post it on our corporate intranet and it will form the basis of discussions with staff.

PN84

What we have also done since that point in time, Commissioner, is set out a schedule of what we call road shows and what would happen is that the subject matter experts in occupational health and safety and workers comp and myself will visit all capital cities, except for Tasmania.

PN85

THE COMMISSIONER: Poor old Tasmania is always forgotten.

PN86

MR O'BRIEN: Poor old Tasmania always misses out. I’ll talk about how we will deal with those issues in a moment - and major worksites so that in Melbourne we will present a number of road shows at our King Street site, at Docklands and Spencer Street where we have our lending services people, so that we comprehensively provide opportunities for retail staff to come into the central area, but also our major worksites will have the opportunity of being able to attend these road shows.

PN87

We’re planning to do Melbourne on 8 and 9 February and then commencing the week of 12 February, move to Brisbane and Sydney and then finish off the end of the week in Adelaide and then head to Perth the following week. Once again, we have provided a draft table that sets out the proposed times of the road shows. I think we have discussed it with the FSU. They were concerned at one stage about the fact that we should hold further road shows out in the suburbs particularly of Sydney and some of the major country towns.

PN88

What we have decided to do is that we will be filming a segment for NAB TV, which will be based on the material contained in the road shows and that will be shown either at NAB TV during the course of the day so that the employees can just tune into our own television program to watch that, and if necessary we can provide a DVD copy to particular workplaces so that they will have the benefit of being able to see what information was delivered to the road shows if they were unable to attend.

PN89

What we have also done, Commissioner, is to organise occ health and safety committee meetings. In Victoria they kicked off last week and also in Tasmania. I personally attended one of the meetings and both our occ health and safety and workers comp experts attended the others. We have a timetable for extraordinary meetings in New South Wales on 6 February. We have been discussing some logistical issues with the FSU as to how that would operate because what we were proposing was that the committees would meet - because I think there are four committees scattered across the state that they would meet in the their own locations and then they would all dial in. But that’s not exactly how the FSU want us to proceed on that so we will either try and arrange for committee members to come to a central place or we will break it up and hold separate committee meetings.

PN90

We’ll follow on - that’s to be held on 6 February. We’re also looking at the South Australian occ health and safety committee also to be on 6 February and Queensland and Western Australia on the 7th, so we would hopefully have covered off all those avenues in that week leading up to our road shows. So hopefully that will cover off the committee meetings. It is also proposed that we have a meeting of our joint consultative committee on 15 February.

PN91

So they would be the major planks in our consultation processes. What we will also be doing is each staff will be advised for corporate intranet in the next couple of days as to the times and locations, as to where all of the road shows will be and we’ll try and facilitate as best we can employees’ attendance at that. We will also be advised, and if they can’t attend, that the session will be produced on NAB TV. We will also provide messages on our corporate internet advising - reemphasising that we will have FAQs on the system and employee feedback lines.

PN92

That’s the progress that we have made. We still have, as I say, some outstanding issues, that we’re looking for FSU consultation on the development. We believe we have made significant progress on that and hopefully, over the next day or two, we will finalise those issues and be ready to roll onto the next stages. If the Commission pleases.

PN93

THE COMMISSIONER: Thanks, Mr O’Brien. Mr Laragy or Ms Hannan?

PN94

MR LARAGY: Would it be all right if I just said a couple of things in response to what John said and then I might hand over to Ms Hannan, if that’s all right?

PN95

THE COMMISSIONER: Yes, that’s fine. And you can remain seated, Ms Hannan, in Sydney. It would save us bobbing up and down and trying to keep our camera on you. Yes, Mr Laragy.

PN96

MR LARAGY: Commissioner, I don’t really want to question anything that Mr O’Brien has had to say - maybe some of the timing was not completely accurate. Just in terms of when we provided feedback, we didn’t necessarily provide this morning, but Mr O’Brien has been away so for that reason there has been some timing delays.

PN97

Just in relation to the film segments for NAB TV, rather than just a commitment by the business that the segment be filmed, we’d also be looking for obviously a commitment that people would be able to take the time and be released from work to be able to watch it otherwise it’s a reasonably pointless exercise. The other thing that we have sought is a spot for the FSU on NAB TV and at this stage I think the answer to that may be no but I think it’s probably worth mentioning that because of the significance of this issue and the difficulty with consulting with 26,000 people, and because there is a precedent for FSU to have been on NAB TV before in a different guise when it was called something else. I would just like that to be reconsidered by the business but I suspect Ms Hannan is going to take you through a document that we have circulated to the bank in terms of where the matrix currently is and where we’re hoping to develop that between now and when the road shows begin and the information starts being put on the intranet. If the Commission pleases.

PN98

THE COMMISSIONER: All right. Yes, Ms Hannan?

PN99

MS HANNAN: Thank you, Commissioner. The Commission would be aware of the commitment by NAB concerning the central importance of the consultation of employees and stakeholders to take place concerning their proposed ComCare move. We have met with the bank, as Mr O’Brien has outlined, to advise FSU feedback on the consultation processes that ought to be affected concerning NAB’S proposal to move to the ComCare system. We say that critical to that consultation process is the dissemination of full information that identifies the key aspects on staff’s occupational health and safety and workers compensation entitlements that would apply under ComCare.

PN100

We have provided feedback in terms of one key document that the bank is proposing to circulate to its some 26,000 staff, termed the matrix on 24 January. We had a full discussion on the changes that were being proposed to give effect to the proper consultation which staff on these issues, and we provided a further summary of how those points might be captured by way of Mr Laragy further liaising with Mr O’Brien on - and I appreciate Mr O’Brien has been away.

PN101

But the concern I suppose that we have Commissioner is that as Mr O’Brien has identified, there are a number of road shows that have been proposed throughout the country and occupational health and safety committees on 6 and 8 February - 8 February onwards for the road shows. We are keen to get the document sorted, as it were, in terms of the information that needs to be disseminated to staff before those consultation processes are put in place to enable staff to be more fully informed of the banks proposal.

PN102

Commissioner, what we would propose noting those dates or the occupational health and safety committee meetings continue starting 6 February that subject to the Commission’s convenience that we would go into conference now to see if we could confirm on the content or progress as far as possible on the matrix document and following that just come back to the Commission to give a brief report back on when we would next seek to appear before the Commission to advise how we are progressing on the overall issues. If the Commission pleases.

PN103

THE COMMISSIONER: Thanks. Mr O’Brien?

PN104

MR O'BRIEN: I haven’t got a problem with going into a private conference, Commissioner.

PN105

THE COMMISSIONER: All right. We’ll adjourn into conference.

<NO FURTHER PROCEEDINGS RECORDED